All elites need some kind of internal disciplinary mechanism for their polity to function.
In traditional societies, it is mainly the aristocracy’s sense of solidarity, noblesse oblige, feudal bonds, the Mannerbund institute. Though I don’t mean to idealize it. It proved completely maladaptive come the industrial age.
In totalitarian regimes, chiliastic ideology and repression/terror plays a major role.
Modern, largely non-ideological populist regimes at odds with GloboHomo – that’s Putin, Orban, etc. – distribute resources or economic “demesnes” to their cronies, creating networks of personal loyalty unbeholden to the global elites – a sort of “counter-elite,” or Dugin’s so-called “patriotic corruption“. One additional “benefit” of such systems is that damning kompromat is available on “defectors” by default. Though obviously this is not the only mechanism. Putinism also has elements of a Mannerbund, as well as more severe punishments.
China has elements of all the above, but with greater load on legitimizing ideology (it is still a Marxist-Leninist state) and on repression.
But how does GloboHomo, Blue Empire, Davos World, ZOG – call it what you will – keep its elites in line?
Western propaganda would have you believe it’s some inherent feature of liberal democracy – the political equivalent of efficient free markets.
Alternatively, the remarkable consolidation of ideology in politics, media, and academia across both the Atlantic and ideological spectrum in decade or two can be explained by requiring some critical number of “Inner Party” members to engage in highly criminal and morally damning “rituals” to advance in station (as Ron Unz has suggested in a recent essay that has suddenly become extremely pertinent). For this mechanism to work, the “rituals” in question must remain strongly taboo. It is rather curious to note that pedophilia is perhaps the one sexual deviation that hasn’t become more “understood” in the past decade, and if anything the converse – even though mutilating children in the name of gender ideology is now all fine and dandy.
The patsy in charge of organizing and taping all this kompromat can enjoy life and be amply rewarded for it, but as we see, he is ultimately disposable so far as the real power brokers are concerned.
They need not worry about exposure. Picus News can be relied upon to divert to Russia. The smol brains on either side will debate whether the #BodyCount is Trump’s or Clinton’s.
Please keep off topic posts to the current Open Thread.
If you are new to my work, start here.
Sounds a bit far-fetched, and also raises the question who would organize such an all-encompassing conspiracy. I know many Unz readers would say it’s (((those people))), and I can even imagine that powerful individuals would be targeted like that for lobbyist purposes. But as an explanation for the entire ideological system of today’s West it’s pretty weak.
Also not sure imo that “pedophilia” is accurate here, as far as I understand it was more about teenage girls. Genuine pedophilia must be a comparatively rare sexual orientation.
Amusing to watch though, I suppose American politics will become even more unhinged now (Trump has apparently already insinuated the Clintons had Epstein killed).
I think your vision of nobility is a bit all too rosy. The nobles were loyal to the King ( or another higher ranked lord) because they obtained material rewards for their service in exchange of lands, serfs…Nobles were very often rebellious and tried to overthrow their lord if they were not satisfied with the present arrangement. France has in my opinion the richest medieval history of al European countries and the Hundred Years’ War provides plenty of examples of noble betrayal, with the most typical one being the Duke of Burgundy siding with the Angevines against the Capetians.When Louis XIV tried to create a proto modern state by creating the first “absolute monarchy”,he tried to neuter the nobility by turning them into fat cats and relieving them of all responsibilities such as armed service. Whenever a monarch tried to overturn the nobility’s privileges, he surely could expect being stabbed to death. Russian nobles didn’t bother with honor and loyalty when it came to removing Pavel Petrovich from the throne when he abolished some of their privileges. Ultimately power is about distributing wealth to your backers, whether you are in a democracy, dictatorship or monarchy. Democracy just happens to make the process smoother and more discrete. The “patriotic corruption” seems to be an an actualisation of old age feudal bonds to modern day capitalism.
More generally, I find the fixation of many right-wingers on conspiracy theories (“false flags” etc.) somewhat tedious. Not that there aren’t any conspiracies (there probably are), but it seems like a shortcut or a quick fix to me, so one doesn’t have to do hard thinking about the ideology of one’s opponents and why it might appeal to people, or do a serious analysis of organizations and institutions.
No matter. My surmise is that robbing the cradle must remain taboo in any civilized society, enforced (at least in part) for the benefit of honest men who respect girlhood even as the transition to womanhood is underway.
https://youtu.be/UaYudGCT1G0
They actually cannot keep people in line. Thus the constant pressure and threats of boycotts, doxing, loss of job, expulsions from school, etc., which generally comes from the left.
They wouldn’t need so many threats or violence if their ‘people’ geniuinely believed in what they were sprouting.
Many politicians on the left get into office by promising benefits or extra monies that are ultimately unaffordable for any society to pay off; thus, another feature of the left driving the countries that elect them into debt. Of course, the right or center has to eventually up the ante to stay or keep their own elected offices; so it becomes a never ending loop of each party trying to outbid the other to stay in power.
But I believe if you bore down into it the cycle actually begins with the left…
While I share your hesitation to dive deeper into the crazy world of conspiracies I would suggest that you look deeper into yourself and wonder what is holding you back where you are in your life. Turn the subject into the object. Think of petit bourgeois mentality and how come it was deployed so successfully against the majority. You see there are people with ambitions and aspirations greater than you in your modest existence could ever imagine. They can’t be constrained with the petit bourgeois mentality, so there must be something else that both liberate them and constrains them, that makes them eligible for the highest echelons of power and success. Something is holding them together. AK is groping for an answer to what is this ‘something’.
I don’t think it has to be quite so dramatic. America has a strong puritan streak (and a love of gossip) and if you can “prove” that somebody cheated on his wife, made a racist joke or grabbed a female co-worker’s butt at a drunken office Christmas party, you can thereby effectively end his career. And since basically everybody has done that sort of mildly inappropriate thing, the “kompromat” is already out there just waiting to be found, no need to manufacture it.
In USA, seems like political partisanship is the main driver of elite discipline, with think tank and contractor sinecures as incentives. A Republican or Democrat with proposals or claims that hurt the party (or the party’s donors) will quickly be reigned in by the rest of the party. If that fails, the GOP/Democrat linked media conglomerates can defame or ignore them, and any chance at a good sinecure vanishes.
That being said, the Hastert case shows that there are some blackmail cases too. Always wondered if his blackmail was involved in GOP leadership’s support for intervention in former Yugoslavia. The Turks were involved somehow, iirc.
Luke 17:2
These so-called ‘elites’ are quite literal satanists, and pedophilia is part of their black mass act.
I doubt most are even sexually attracted to children, they’re just doing it because it’s a required religious rite in their circles.
Maybe it was blackmail in Hastert’s case, but in the case of all the other US Congressman and Senators, it was aggressive lobbying against Serbs by their enemies. That is, ethnic Croat, Muslim and Albanian representatives or lobbyists to the US government and elsewhere.
For instance, Mira Ricardel was a literal Croat bitch whose parents were probably Ustashe scum, and yet, she started her career in US politics during the 1990’s as a personal aide to Bob Dole (he lobbied aggressively for US intervention in support of Croats, Muslims and Albanians against Serbs because he was payed to do so). Also, apparently according to the Washington Post, “She developed a reputation as a Russia hawk and was seen as a tough bureaucratic player with a strong personality”.
Mira Ricardel even became the literal US National Security Advisor to Trump’s administration, until under Melania Trump’s influence, she was fired in 2018. Melania Trump’s dad was a Slovenian Sovok Communist during the Former Yugoslavia, so it was probably personal on Melania’s part to fire her. Mira Ricardel must literally appear to be some random bitch to most of the world, which is why her firing by Melania in 2018 doesn’t make any sense other than in this context.
Unfortunately, this bitch was fired way too late for it to make a difference. The aggressive international anti-Serb intervention in the 1990’s is much easier to understand when it becomes clear that ethnic groups hostile to Serbs had high level lobbyists and decisive influence over US, European, and world decision makers, and media, while Serbs had absolutely none …
It was in Empire’s interest to dismantle Yugoslavia (it’s usefulness as part of Anglo sphere of influence and Kennan’s doctrine of containment had expired, in addition to no longer Croats dominating it politically) and cut Serbs down to size (the only statefounding and potentially sovereign nation in the Yugoslavia, and pro-Russian traditionally).
They gained completely obedient vassal states, new market for their big business and a ridiculous amount of loot (transition and privatization, Serbia included).
Ruder Finn and other Western companies were paid handsomely by Croats, Bosniaks to spread anti-Serb nonsense to the extent of framing Serbs as Holocaust perpetrators (Israel and Jews were supressed in this one – they helped secretly and clandestinely) who are doing it again, this time to Croats and Bosniaks. When CNN, Clinton, whole of German political scene, Norwegian social-democrats and others start spouting the same idiotic narrative (victim numbers) and wildly chauvinistic rhetorics – it has nothing to do with lobbying. When Wesley Clark proclaims nation states are undesirable as a pretense for bombing Serbia (most diverse area of ex-Yugo) right after USA destroyed Yugoslavia created ethnonationalist homogenous Slovenia, Croatia, Kosovo and split Bosnia into three ethnic regions – they are obviously taunting us.
Eliot Engel, Bob Dole, Burchett and other disfigured imbeciles have nothing to do with it.
The same can be said of idiots paid by Serbs and Serbia to represent Serb interests.
Geopolitics is a rational discipline, Anglos and Americans had demonstrated perfect grasp of it in the last 400 years.
Power holders and brokers don’t actually believe in the nonsense and propaganda they authorize – but they are behind it and they obviously did the math – benefits are simply there for USA.
Noise raised by media, pundits and especially true believer useful idiots can be ignored. One should only browse twitterspher
https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2017/10/paedophilia-and-politicians/
I almost forgot!
My favourite Croat propaganda investment?
A court historian!
Sabrina P. Ramet – a transgendered “Norwegian” “woman” who was born a Mexican man.
Another “Western expert” and favourite English wikipedia source (on everything, from WW2 to Partisans, to Yugocommunists, Serbs, 1990s – screw the documents and peer-reviewed authors!), who speaks no local language, has never consulted primary sources, has been repeatedly proven wrong, caught falsifying and has been paid by Croatia and granted awards for “quality work”.
Agree.
I would only contend that much of this was a combination of a product of lobbying and a large international coalition gathering together, since many of its smaller and weaker parties had something to gain from attacking Serbs. Still, you’re definitely right in that any attempt at Serb lobbying would have been a lost cause to begin with.
Really, the only thing Serbs had going for them in the Yugoslav wars was being the majority overall population with access to most of the military equipment in Yugoslavia. Milosevic basically completely threw this advantage away when in 1992 he withdrew the JNA from Krajina and Bosnia, instead of sending it to capture Zagreb and other key cities, just like he did with Vukovar in 1991. That is, of course, in order to force Tudjman and the others to capitulate. The moment that Milosevic betrayed the Serbs in those regions (especially with inviting UNPROFOR to Krajina in 1992, and then sanctioning Republika Srpska in 1995) is the moment that it was all basically over and everything else was doomed to happen as it did. The outcome of the Yugoslav wars was already decided in 1991 and 1992.
Hence the reason why we are both commenting in Anatoly Karlin’s comment section and are at the Unz Review in general.
Lol, really? Is Twitter where 21st century elites reveal their true form and intent?
No, I got cut off during editing – twittersphere is the definite proof that the noise should be ignored.
Actually Germany was the driving force behind the dismantling of Yugoslavia, continuing traditional German foreign policy in the region of small fragmented states under German tutelage. Unified Germany was the US point man in the region and so the US went along with it, Clinton, Jewish groups and the arms lobby had their own reasons. Turkey is often overlooked, but they were very aggressively involved and lobbied the US extensively and have their own influence operations.
https://www.peterbcollins.com/2016/05/04/in-depth-interview-sibel-edmonds-details-the-coverup-of-the-most-serious-crimes-of-dennis-hastert/
https://washingtonmonthly.com/2015/05/29/dennis-hasterts-money-problem/
Got it LOL (Would’ve slapped it on that comment, but can’t be bothered waiting for the lol to recharge).
There isn’t enough of a Puritan streak, politicians are increasingly getting away with all sorts of corruption and misbehaviour.
” . . . [R]equiring some critical number of “Inner Party” members to engage in highly criminal and morally damning “rituals” to advance in station . . .”
Yep, I’ll go with that. Seen it, know it.
Jack McCoy, the character played by Sam Waterston in Law and Order compliments his junior colleague, who I think has either perjured herself or suborned perjury to obtain a conviction, “Welcome to the bigs [the big leagues]”.
(Sorry, only time for a quick comment. As a general rule, the possibility that a political decision has been enabled by criminal or civil misconduct should never be excluded.)
Epigon never disputed any of this. By the way, Germany was also actually arming Croatia and Slovenia by selling weapons to Croat and Slovenian separatist groups back in the 1980’s, several years before the collapse of Yugoslavia in 1990. Germany also used the Yugoslav Wars as a pretext to justify it’s re-militarization for the first time since 1945 to the world. That is, after the reunion of East and West Germany. Germany claimed it was doing “humanitarian good” in Bosnia and Kosovo with its newly gained military …
Regardless of Germany, Turkey, and all the other secondary or lesser parties and partners to the international anti-Serb coalition, the USA’s role as the head of NATO and the Empire was decisive. None of the decisions made by the other actors would’ve made much difference if it wasn’t for the actions of the USA. The USA was the ultimate driving force behind the dissolution of Yugoslavia since US Ambassador Warren Zimmerman stated to Milosevic that the USA considered it unacceptable for force to be used against Croat separatists in 1990. Warren Zimmerman also started the Bosnian War of 1992-1995 by persuading Alija Izetbegovic to withdraw his signature from an internationally mediated agreement between Serbs, Muslims and Croats to have a decentralized Bosnia (In other words, to impose Muslim hegemony over Serbs like Izetbegovic had originally hoped to do so). Warren Zimmerman fancied himself as the colonial overlord of the Balkans …
Sasha Baron Cohen inadvertently showed that incentives matter.
https://twitter.com/NlK0S/status/1160366348926685185
High level blackmail also helps but we all know what attitudes and behaviours are incentivised.
The BRD and the DDR were already remilitarised during the Cold War due to perceived military necessity by their respective American and Soviet suzerains.
In fact, following the end of the Cold War Germany’s army as well as many European nations’ armies fell into neglect.
Absolute garbage. During the Cold war both West and East Germany maintained large standing armies (West Germany’s Bundeswehr had a strength of almost 500 000 in 1985, with about 300 000 active soldiers) and had conscription. After 1990 the Bundeswehr was massively reduced and now has below 200 000 soldiers, for all of reunified Germany. There is no “remilitarization”, in fact Germany’s military capabilities have largely been eroded since 1990.
It’s true that Germany’s decision for recognition of Slovenian and Croatian independence wasn’t coordinated with other European powers and the US. But main driver for the later Kosovo war was Clinton’s administration.
My bad. Should’ve clarified and written that I meant international military intervention instead of “re-militarization”. As in, that Germany used the Yugoslav Wars to overcome the likely and inevitable objections of its neighbors to Germany engaging in international military interventions (among other things).
Have there been any independent German military interventions since then? No, it’s always part of some NATO (or sometimes European) mission, where Germany’s “partners”, especially the Americans, always whine that Germany isn’t doing enough.
What keeps the GLOBAL-HOMO US ELITES IN POWER:
Tucker Carlson:”And if Kamala Harris is elected POTUS on Nov 3 2020…..I will gracefully…and in a respectfull and principled way, disagree with POTUS KAMALA HARRIS’S anti-White Genocidal Policies unlike those RACIST Alt Righters And White Nationalists…..I Tucker Carlson will consent to be governed by POTUS KAMALA HARRIS…..”
War for Blair Mountain:”DON’T CONSENT TO BE GOVERNED AND RULED OVER BY THE HINDUS!!!….For they will force you to clean the gold-plated toilets of PREET BHARRARA encrusted with curry turd tendrils……..YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED…..” This is the Endgame of consenting to be governed by the HINDU “AMERICANS”…..
Group rituals are a common bonding mechanism in many social groups. Mundane organizations like Alcoholics Anonymous, the Boy Scouts, and the Lions Club have such rituals. Taboo, secret rituals are more powerful still.
The Epstein conspiracy is plausible in that it involves the taboo practice of ordinary sexuality that has been pathologized. Sexually mature teenage girls are sexually desirable and capable of reproduction, but relationships between them and adult men have been severely pathologized (and often criminally forbidden) in the past generation in the United States.
If you try to have a discussion with normies about hot jailbait girls, they’ll immediately claim that it’s disgusting pedophilia. This has gotten to the point where normies claim a man in his thirties dating a girl in her early twenties is somehow “damaged” because he’s “afraid” of women his own age. Parents now notify the police of “child abuse” when teenage boys get some action from their hot twenty-something teachers. I’m sure those boys are crying themselves to sleep at night…
Contrary to the musings of various Balkanoid and Eastern European commenters who think Western elites don’t take their own propaganda seriously, they do. Probably most of them believe screwing sixteen year old girls is somehow inherently disgusting and gross. But I would imagine that after enough time spent around bouncy young scantily clad girls, ordinary male sexual urges take over. Another thing worth remembering is that the Baby Boomer generation came of age before such relationships were pathologized. In the 1970s plenty of “famous” groupies weren’t even sixteen.
As for this being the lynchpin of elite unity in the West, I doubt it. The story of Mossad kompromat makes more sense to me. After all, a figure like Mike Pence is completely immune to this sort of thing yet is a loyal and unquestioning member of the elite.
Elite unity is maintained by ideology, educational institutions, media propaganda, censorship, socialization, material incentives, class solidarity, the criminal “justice” system and the courts, the threat of assassination, and lately mob pressure as well. This is actually really not that interesting, except perhaps to non-Westerners who don’t understand how our elites can believe in such obvious rubbish.
More interesting is the tools they use to disrupt the formation of counter-elites that threaten their grip on power. The same tools used to disrupt foreign countries are employed at home. I’m not a public figure, yet on occasion various losers have made efforts to dox me (I’m immune, don’t waste your time).
Completely untrue. As late as 1998 UCK/KLA was on American Terror Organization list.
BND had been involved with them since 1980s – in fact, more than one “former Bundeswehr” German “volunteer” was embedded with them during the war.
The KLA itself started as a combined effort of Communist Hoxha Albania and WW2 Shqiptar Fascist auxiliaries’ descendants.
They specialized in murdering civilians, post workers, ambushing policemen and bombings targeting Serb refugees fleeing from Croatia and Bosnia.
From the mid-1990s BND started sending weapons and instructors both to Kosovo and Albania – once Albania descended into chaos in 1997 – KLA ranks swelled – prisons were emptied, and in addition to BND, CIA and SAS formed training camps inside Albania and intensified the training. Italians and French joined in – PELICAN.
Just as in case of Yugoslavia break-up, Americans came in late, calculated the optimum strategy for maximizing their gains and interests and assumed leadership, engaging the turbo mode – first in media, than with bombs and operatives in the field.
Germany had counted on restoring Slovenia and Croatia to their historical German sphere, but Americans actually swooped in, took over Croatia as early as 1990s and have consolidated their control there to this day.
And how are Americans going to express their wish “not to be governed and ruled over by” Indians? Czolgosz style?
But in any case, I do find it amusing how it tends to attract “far-right” accusations to point out that neither Harris nor Maximka are entirely like normal black Americans in both their social and ethnic backgrounds.
So you want to tell me that Germany somehow succeeded into pressuring an unwilling US to bomb Serbia? How?
The Americans had already been heavily involved with the Croatian Krajina offensive in 1995 anyway, so supporting Kosovaran separatism wasn’t that big a step.
What the BND did – no idea. And tbh I don’t care.
Which part of it?
Do they believe in gas station Russia, or Russia about to conquer Europe one?
Do they believe in powerless incompetent Russia, or Russia influencing and deciding elections in the West, subverting democracies Russia?
The Spain/Italy Russian economy, or Russia challenging USA/NATO to such extreme degree that trillion more dollars are needed to counter the Russian threat?
I stand by my claim that actual people in charge don’t give a shit about nonsense peddled by MSM, social media, think tank tards.
And who exactly constitutes USA elite?
No, just as in case of Yugoslavia break-up, the Americans hit multiple birds with one stone. Guerilla war was already taking place by 1998 and 1999, so Americans took the leadership role and settled things in a way that suited them best.
Blocking German influence was one of them. They are really good at this, with minimum involvement and expenditures they gained the whole Balkans where empires of the past wasted countless lives and resources.
They believe in all of this.
Some of this is of course contradictory, which doesn’t really matter since it’s not like human belief is logical or consistent. The particular inconsistency between the powerless, incompetent Russia and Russia poised to conquer Europe is neatly explained by the alleged fecklessness and weakness of our European allies. This then provides a convenient pretext for massive arms spending as well as badgering American allies to increase their own armaments expenditures.
This was all very neatly on display in the aftermath of the sad collapse of the ridiculous Russiagate conspiracy theory. The complete absence of evidence has in no way diminished the belief of Russian interference in the 2016 elections nor that Trump is an agent of Putler. Lately the so-called left has taken to branding the bland Republican Senate Majority Leader, Sen. Mitch McConnell, as “Moscow Mitch”.
Powerful politicians, federal judges, billionaires (oligarchs), Big Law partners, Fortune 500 CEOs, the big five banks, key think tanks and NGOs, organized Jewry, media organs and their controllers (both owners and key executives), tenured elite university professors, big oil, the military-industrial complex, intelligence agencies, ethnic lobbyists, etc.
Your explanation is much too plausible and common-sense to get any traction around these parts.
As I said before, if Globohomo elites are so hard to hit, why not hit their logistics and support troops instead, like how submarines in WW2 went after slower merchant ships instead of well armed and fast warships like cruisers and battleships.
They put up a show for the plebs. Information available publicly is worthless – money and power revolve around privileged and secret info.
Everything being thrown around and claimed in the open is predominantly nonsense, virtue signaling, posturing and empty rhetorics.
I would narrow the elite to political, intelligence and military – moneyed individuals are at the total mercy of above mentioned.
I find it hard to believe that USA long term strategy was shaped by lobbyists, CEOs and journalists. Or Jews, as a matter of fact. USA has had too much success and too rapid a rise in the last 2 centuries.
You’re projecting the mentality of your own corner of the world onto America.
There’s no difference in the show for the plebs and what elites believe in the West. Remember that we’re talking about an inner-Hajnal elite whose historical condition is high trust, non-kin cooperation, and religious fanaticism (Protestant zeal now replaced with globohomo).
Take for instance the unguarded clip of Gordon Brown:
In an unguarded moment you can see he sincerely believes that opposition to immigration is simply bigotry.
Publicly available information is quite useful. In the 1950s the KGB station chief in New York City considered his most valuable intelligence resource to be the Scientific-American magazine.
Military elites in the conventional sense do not exist in the United States. Officers might as well be eunuchs. They have to toe the party line in order to get promoted and to secure lucrative sinecures after being cashiered.
Moneyed elites who choose to wage a private war against the powers that be will find themselves targeted by the “system”, but those who choose to play along accumulate power which they use to pursue both their own personal interests and those of the system.
The US doesn’t have a long-term strategy anymore than any other country does. Probably less since power breeds complacency and infighting. The Jews have almost nothing at all to do with America’s rise to power, but quite a lot to do with America’s current destructive foreign and social policies.
Well then, what else is the NATO and international aggression and attack on ethnic Serbs and Serbia in the 1990’s besides a group ritual of criminal, illegal and barbaric aggression against a sovereign people?
NATO qualifies as a formerly mundane organization ultimately responsible for this group ritual. NATO truly revealed itself as the North Atlantic Terrorist Organization with its behavior in the 1990’s. Literally every participant in this group ritual from Iran to the USA is still eager to keep up the lies, propaganda and manipulated half-truths about the Yugoslav Wars. Every single participant in this group ritual deserves to be permanently cursed for as long as they maintain their lies, propaganda and continued efforts to destroy Serbia and Serbs …
Tbh, I don’t care about the Cologne mass rapes. I also don’t care about the replacement of native Germans by browns, blacks and Muslims.
In anyway they….THE HISTORIC NATIVE BORN WHITE AMERICAN WORKING CLASS MAJORITY…sees fit…
It all starts with NOT CONSENTING TO HINDU “AMERICAN RULE”…..
Within the borders of the US…There are now two Nations:One nonwhite…the other White….And they hate each other…..The Nonwhite Nation is just more open about it…..There are irreconcilable differences on the SAME SHARED LIVING AND BREEDING SPACE…..I mean, it’s become very primal…primate….gut level…
Interestingly, Jimmy Stewardt’s Anthropologist daughter wrote a very interesting book how lowland gorilla bands solve their tribal differences:warfare….It is hardwired into our brains via evolution……CIVIC NATIONALIST CUCKS are in for a very rude awakening….as are the Alt Right Partition Enthusiasts…
The ANTIFA….White Leftists…White Liberals are very much on to do something:THE ENDGAME IS MASS EXPULSION!!!…The only question is which Race-based Nation gets to experience MASS EXPULSION out of off of the US……FIRST!!!!….And, The Democratic Party Debates makes it very ver clear,that, White Liberals…backed by massive White Oligarch Power…..have launched a pre-emptive strike against THE HISTIRIC NATIVE BORN WHITE AMERICAN WORKING CLASS MAJORITY in the direction of MASS EXPULSION into a corrugated aluminium shack in a desolate corner of Idaho surrounded by the real “Americans” descended from the current Chobani Muslim “American” Workforce…in Idaho
This thread isn’t about Serbs and their real or imagined suffering, but about Western elites ritually raping and murdering children, so the Jews and masons can blackmail them.
Maybe they take special delight in tormenting Serbian children (who knows? Are there a lot of missing children in Serbia?), but so far nobody has shown any connection between Epstein and Kosovo. Maybe you should ask Ron Unz to look into it.
No, this thread is about elites in general. That is, how they function, especially in the context of disciplining themselves to continue with their activities. Just because you’re a German cuck, it doesn’t mean you have to ignore the broad potential range of discussion under the pretext of such a topic …
Please don’t bore me to death with the “WHO BUMPED OFF JEFFREY EPSTIEN” Conspiracy theories….If anyone was down at his RAPE RESORT…they were RAPING Russian teenage girls…We know more than enough right now for indictment in the COURT OF PUBLIC OPINION…
So this perp list includes:Bill Clinton….Alan Dershowitz…Hillary Clinton…Physcists Kip Thorne…Lisa Randall….And Steven Hawking(Perhaps the fit Rock Climber Lisa Randall held down these Russian Teenage girls to help Steven Hawkins get his jollies….)…It’s what White American Liberals do…..
Balkanoid narcissism.
Not everything is about your cursed corner of Europe.
Is there theory as to why modern elites might want to spread degeneracy among the masses and the bourgeois and the masses? After all Republican Roman elites were very conservative and spread their conservative Roman values called gravitas among the populace, and likewise medieval nobility were very conservative and spread Christianity by the sword if necessary, like what happened in the Baltics, and Victorian and Edwardian elites were also conservative, which encouraged conservative behavior among the Victorian middle class.
It’s a shame my LOL hasn’t reloaded yet.
Yo Karlin, Russian soft power be rising!
http://www.anime1.com/watch/dumbbell-nan-kilo-moteru/episode-6
The funny thing is that this is also the opinion of one of CNN‘s and Time Magazine‘s best-known commentators, Robert Baer, yet few people seem to care.
Knowing that this happened in the former Yugoslavia, we can be quite sure that similar strategies were employed in the former Soviet Union to make it as fractured as possible. I’m thinking of Ukraine, especially, but also of separatist causes that never quite took off, such as that in Tatarstan.
Sounds like commie garbage. It should be possible to hold a critical view of the role of outside powers in the Balkan wars without succumbing to the fanciful idea that Balkan nationalists did what they did just because imperialist-capitalist powers paid them to do so, and otherwise everyone would have gotten along peacefully in multiculti socialist paradise.
Republican Roman elites did also stop doing that and embrace degeneracy.
https://twitter.com/PyotrNemets/status/1127288655712645120
Perhaps, but that’s the publication asking the question, not the former CIA agent answering them. In case you are wondering, he puts forth the exact same view in interviews with Western-oriented publications:
That article is from Sarajevo Times, which writes this about itself:
Robert Baer is a strange guy, he says lot of weird stuff, e.g. this:
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2006/04/17/the-iran-plans
(in recent years he seems to have changed his tune on Iran, no idea why).
Was there American, German etc. involvement in the break-up of Yugoslavia? Of course, the role of outside powers was certainly quite negative at times. Does that mean Yugoslavia wouldn’t have broken apart otherwise? I doubt it, imo it was a flawed construct.
But tbh I have no interest in discussing this any further, the topic of depraved elites raping children in satanic orgies is a lot more interesting.
I think you are still being too indulgent. Baer makes quite clear that the CIA’s aim was to play divide and conquer by giving as loud a voice as possible to the most extremist elements in the former Yugoslavia. How is this is even remotely defensible?
How exactly was that “unguarded”? Opposition to immigration – even mere skepticism – is routinely portrayed as bigoted by the media. Seems to me he was just using the same language in private as he would in public.
Unguarded would be if some black guy demanded Brown promise to commit resources to “fighting racism” and then in the car he said “Who put me next to that stupid nagger? Who’s idea was that?”
He quite likely does believe that opposition to immigration is simply bigotry, but his calling that woman bigoted does not prove it. He may even have had private misgivings about immigration himself, but as a good politician, he may have simply known that being associated with immigration opponents was a bad look for his campaign.
In hockey is called protecting the puck, in capitalism it should be called protecting the buck(s). Once you have them – the bucks, everything you do as elites, all the schemes, democracy, think thanks, all roads should lead to that principal doctrine – protecting the buck.
The degeneracy happens because the main principle of the game gets overemphasized and as a result the main goal is achieved, but everything else stars to fall apart. Having played the same game for too long, the Capitalists lose sense of when it’s time to relax the rules little bit, because doing so goes against the main principle.
The main fear of Capitalists is socialism, so some of the ways they invented in order to combat it – are exactly GloboHomo and 3rd world immigration. Those policies protect the buck(capitalism), but they destroy countries, societies and civilization.
In capitalist minds those are synonyms, without capitalism, it’s not worth having a country, society or civilization. And now the degeneracy comes a full circle. Maybe capitalism will be the last to go, while everything else around it collapses, but will it be worth it? Because in order to function, capitalism still needs a country, society and civilization, because it’s less important than all 3 of them and it’s destroying them.
Go back to Ireland you drunk bum.
Serbs mostly have themselves to blame. They massively fumbled the dissolution of Yugoslavia. No group’s hands were clean in the ensuing wars, but somehow Serbs managed to get themselves depicted as the prime villains despite the cachet of having been on the “right” side of WWII and victims of genocide themselves (even allowing for exaggerations of Jasenovac numbers), while their opponents’ nationalisms were often resurrecting fascist-era symbols and slogans, and Croatia’s president was even a holocaust revisionist. That is some serious ineptitude!
But of course the problem goes back to Serbian nationalism itself, which was the main driver of Yugoslav dissolution. Some of it was an understandable response to Albanian and Croatian secessionist agitation, but it went way beyond this. The standard western narrative of the Yugoslav conflict is basically correct here. When Serbs early on went on the offensive and seized large portions of territory in Croatia and Bosnia and started deporting people, western liberal elites were always going to identify Serbs as ethnic oppressors, even without the aid of ethnic lobbies.
The smart way to play it would have been to refuse to initiate violence and allow Serbs to be victimized. If the regimes in Zagreb and Sarajevo refused to cooperate and play their assigned role, charges of ethnic intimidation could always be manufactured, given the aforementioned WWII associations. Serbs could then have produced their own version of a Haris Silajdzic figure to wow and woo western liberals. With enough suffering, Serbs may even have been allowed to eventually send in the tanks and grab some Croat/Bosnian territory and do a bit of ethnic cleansing themselves, Oluja-style. (Happy 25th anniversary!) In that scenario, there probably would have been no question of western countries allowing Albanian separatists to seize Kosovo.
All this would have required that the lesson Serbs learned from WWII was that if ethnonationalism gets out of hand, it can get very ugly, so therefore it is best to rein it in. Instead, being unregenerate balkanoid retards (Thornfinsson’s quite right about this, even if it hurts to hear it), the “lesson” that Serbs learned was that their own side didn’t get a large enough share of the spoils, and they wanted to make up for it.
I will now demonstrate utmost respect for our host, the topic of the thread, the posters I look forward to reading – and NOT respond to the cretin above and his off-topic excrements.
It would be nice if everyone followed suit. It would do wonders for post quality outside Open threads, and save others from Balkan, Ukr-Rus bickering no one is interested in.
ITT:
People who don’t have a clue about how and why the ex-YU broke up, and a couple of Serbs who are as usual, completely full of shit (especially when it comes to the role of Germany).
Interesting, thanks for the links.
One must supposed that fallen nature being what it is, isolated instances of occultism/satanism/ritual murder have occurred always. By aberrant individuals or smallish groups. The Thuggees come to mind as a tribal, large group.
We know also of some cultures where ritual murder was a central and defining characteristic, like the Syrian city-states, the aztecs and perhaps the Harappa.
The Epstein case makes one wonder what percentage of “elites” are perverted, and in what direction they are perverted. What would happen if “elites” decided to worship —one way or another—the ancient gods of lust and terror? Astaroth and Baal, indeed.
Exorcists speak of increased organized satanism amongst the educated and influential. But could those people even believe in something?
Because a system created by perverts selects for perverts……and it gets entrenched…..
By explicitly raising the question of whether elite kompromat is the glue that holds western neoliberalism together, Anatoly Karlin actually helps us put it in perspective. Evidently it is a phenomenon – deployed by a Bush family member against Donald Trump, on the eve of the 2016 election, let us not forget. But if, with The Saker, we designate western ideology as “Anglo-Zionist”, I would tend to think that it is primarily Anglo-Zionist money which maintains elite discipline, with Anglo-Zionist kompromat being a decidedly secondary phenomenon.
Agreed. He always seems to go on these weird rants all the time, and none of them are ever written properly, or coherently. Now he’s complaining about a pretty rational and generous CEO who employs White americans, and who has pledged to give 10% of the company stock to said white americans. He also complains about Preet Bharara who is a litigator who fights against corruption to the best of his ability and power.
Still, it was definitely not okay for NATO to start indiscriminately bombing civilian infrastructure. Lots of innocent people died too, and many of their deaths could have been entirely prevented
If half the things I read about Epstein is true how can such a man not have reach even after his demise?
I’m even more astonished there aren’t any conspiracy theories that he faked his own death. Considering how readily people claim “false flag/staged event” on almost everything based on flimsy ticky-tack shit.
I guess we just need to wait and see if any videos get “leaked” anonymously. If not then Epstein is a special type of retard to have once wielded such blackmail material and not have a dead mans switch for it all.
It is funny to see you reference “Picus News”, that’s exactly how I referred to CBS News when discussing the recent, tragic, suicide, with someone.
On a whim I looked up CBS’ coverage of the event, curious to see how they were spinning it. I’ve got to say, I’m almost in awe of their skills, absolute masters.
Try to watch this clip and not immediately lose interest in the subjet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1vAGzeCE1k
They frame the story in an unclear, dull way. What is Epstein accused of? What, briefly are the leading pieces of evidence? The normie viewer is not told; no salacious details, no pictures of the teen whores he ran, no mention of the powerful men he entrapped. They’re not trying to get attention, they’re trying to bury it.
Then we get to the really masterful stroke: the fuzzy phone call with the expert reporter. Why can’t CBS News of all organizations get a video feed and clear audio? Because that would keep your attention. Instead an uninteresting South Asian reporter woman is talking to some fuzzy voice, with a weird foreign name, about some case. The audience is lost, and that’s the point.
“Always wondered if his blackmail was involved in GOP leadership’s support for intervention in former Yugoslavia.”
No, it was just more virtue signaling.
Like President Trump with that whole A$AP idiot in Sweden…instead of just ignoring the whole situation and letting the Swedes handle it, Trump had to intervene and pressure the Swedes to release him…BTW, A$AP didn’t even have the common courtesy in his tweet thanking everyone for his release to mention Trump as the primary motive for the Swedes releasing him back to the US, probably to commit more acts of crime and mayhem over here.
Thanks Sweden.
So Trump’s virtue signal was for nothing…by the end of the week the media was still blasting him as a racist…and so it continues.
BengaliCanadianDude:
I don’t want to rain on your parade but I’m a little suspicious about brother Preet Bharara. Superficially his professional resume seems impressive, but let’s wait to find out if he’s a dedicated civil servant or just another partisan hack? I lean to the latter based on his behavior on being replaced by Trump! As I recall, he refused to take the President’s phone call, petulantly stating that it would be a conflict of interest – gimme a break!!
BTW, I enjoy your comments as their perspective is a welcome UR addition!!!
To demoralise them and make them easier to control? To destroy the family because it’s an alternative focus of loyalty? To encourage a culture of consumption and hedonism which is good for the corporate bottom line?
Plus if you accept the bioleninism theory those degenerates will be loyal foot soldiers of the elites?
True.
Also, a symptom of this society’s sickness.
I couldn’t agree more.
Well if elite concentration is unavoidable, how can it be incentivised in a way which disincentivices deviancy, which was how elites functioned before the 60s? And about giving low status people status, giving some low status people high status might be less bad than giving other types of low status people high status, for example, giving straight women, or rural Southern white men and women, or talented tenth conservative blacks, or socially conservative Asian people like Twinkie a higher status than they did in the 30s may be a good idea, if only in order to expand the size of the conservative demographics, and is a lot better than giving gays and other sexual deviants, or 70 IQ blacks a high status in the power structure, or a butch black lesbian transexual. And about types of Marxism, some types of Marxism are preferable to others, if that is your only choice, for example, the Soviet geriatric Cominterm run by people like Brezhnev and Andropov, for all of its downsides, is at least still livable, and not not utterly disgusting like the present day Hominterm, and even Karlin pointed this out in the Soviet freezer theory.
I mean since society is inherently hierarchical in nature, isn’t there a way steer the system towards elite systems that are less harmful in nature compared to Globohomo, as I said, the old Cominterm, feudalism, European style absolute monarchy, and a quasi theocracy run by a Confucian scholar gentry class is preferable to the present neoliberal Globohomo system.
I agree that making everything a conspiracy theory is foolish, but you are going to obviously going to dismiss the idea that jewish control of all levers of power as a “conspiracy theory”. I don’t call this a conspiracy theory because jews are very openly in control of the mass media, politicians, censorship, global finance rules etc. They don’t do this because they are having secret meetings, they openly celebrate this is many mainstream outlets.
They like to push the narrative that simply spotting jewish control is a conspiracy theory as an easy way to dismiss those that say jews controlling these things is bad for white people.
sorry to be such a grouch, but isn’t Spandrell talking about a social loser like himselg, he seems to be of above average intelligence, but clearly isn’t good at using that to make a lot of money, and is stuck as a dissident right writer, so he is in effect talking about himself, sounds like an incel too.
A simpler theory is the elite liberation explanation for the sixties and its aftermath.
Elites themselves wanted to engage in degeneracy, and this filtered down to the rest of society. This came first–look at Nelson Rockefeller for instance.
Elites have the discipline to enjoy libertine lifestyles without suffering too much damage, proles do not.
Clamping down on degeneracy would crimp their own lifestyles, and would in any case be “wrong”.
I don’t buy the argument that this was done for economic consumption. Families buy all kinds of things.
The bioleninism theory is good, but it probably wasn’t obvious to anyone sixty years ago that today there’d be a caste of sexual perverts who would be loyal foot soldiers for the regime.
The one sinister motive that does make a lot of sense as being part of a master plan is mobilizing women into the full-time permanent workforce (women have always worked). This also specifically took propaganda to accomplish.
Good comment. Americans seem to have trouble when it comes to getting the definition of words or phrases correct. “Pedophile” does not mean a man who goes after 16-year-olds.
Similarly, “single mother” does not connote divorced women or war widows. It means an unmarried woman who had a child.
I blame the lousy school systems for all this. Muddled definitions mean muddled thoughts and that’s exactly what the system wants — a bunch of flawed thinkers who get everything wrong, so that can be taken advantage of by the One Percent.
So what is the reason why older elites like the Victorian elites, Confucian scholar gentry, or medieval nobility might espouse socially conservative ideology?
I don’t follow Spandrell closely, but if I recall correctly, he said some years ago that he runs his own business and that he was getting married. I understood his blog to be some kind of intellectual hobby. Moldbug also had a job, a wife, and at least one kid, and clearly was having an enormous amount of fun writing Unqualified Reservations.
Of course it isn’t “pretty weak.”
There is, after all, a reason the Church once described certain heresies as “Judaizing” heresies.
In 1890, La Civiltà Cattolica published a work called ‘On the Jewish Question in Europe’
This work argued that any country that abandons its Christian rulers to follow democratic passions will inevitably come to be ruled by the Jews and/or by ideologues permeated with the anti-truth revolutionary spirit inherent in Talmudic Judaism.
Those who disagree simply have not studied enough of or the right kind of Western philosophy and history. It takes some combination of ignorance, dishonesty, or cowardice to be unwilling to face up to facts.
More people ought to watch the excellent Coen Brothers film ‘A Serious Man.’ This film shows what life can be like for those people who find themselves within the Jewish religion but without the power of the Jewish elites. Jeffrey Epstein just provided us with another example.
That fact that you can merely write “there probably are” (emphasis mine) conspiracies is just laughable.
Conspiracies are a common part of human existence for more average people. That’s why we have criminal charges with names like, oh, I don’t know, “conspiracy to commit….”
You just can’t bring yourself to admit that political elites commonly practice them too. Why wouldn’t they?
I would actually be perfectly willing to agree that an obsession with conspiracy theories is bad and totally tedious.
On the other hand, you tend to go too far the other way. “Probably” there are conspiracies? Good grief, that’s dramatically loonier than being a conspiracy theorist!
Finally, Ron Unz’s Our American Pravda series is by no means kooky, although some people didn’t like the World War Two stuff because he’s clearly sympathetic to Nazism. But whatever. Stop being a cuck about this issue. It’s tedious!
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Agreed.
Marxist societies seem to go though brief periods of craziness (the Soviet Union under Lenin, the Cultural Revolution in China) but then they realise that they have to construct functional societies and the craziness gets quietly dropped. Marxist elites learn that reality trumps theory. Our current elites seem to be incapable of understanding this.
The source of their wealth was more closely connected to the moral health of the toiling classes.
Christianity as the dominant religion/ideology also meant one’s own social status was partly tied to good moral behavior.
When you look at the people in control of those areas the non-Jews seem to be pretty much the same, and just as bad, as the Jews. The feminists are perhaps worse than the Jews. We have evil crazy elites.Whether a member of the elites is Jewish or not doesn’t seem to be the crucial factor.
Yeah, that’s quite possible. Or maybe the elites always did engage in degeneracy but they used to be discreet about it.
There’s a reason people used to talk about bourgeois morality. Because the aristocracy weren’t really into morality. They were into doing whatever the hell they liked as long as they didn’t do it in the streets and frighten the horses (and the peasants).
So maybe now our modern elites are becoming more aristocratic in their mindset. And they’re no longer worried about frightening the horses.
I agree, but it leaves the question why did post-modern elites – starting in 60-70’s in the West – let go off all constraints, public image, and eventually collapsed into the current mindless advocacy of degeneracy. We are about 10 years away from making degeneracy compulsory and that’s unique by historical standards.
I believe another dynamic has played a role: one thing that elites always desire is impunity – in effect to be safe in their elite status. Traditional and early Marxist elites were brutally competitive and would use any transgressions (even of a family member) to destroy a rival, often physically. For most of history it wasn’t physically safer to be an elite member than a commoner.
What changed? Maybe the WWI-WWII carnage and the elite blood-letting in endless ‘revolutions’ has created an elite that is very scared and highly values complete impunity. That’s why they hate so much any fellow elite members who are non-conformist and destabilising, e.g. Trump. They fear change because it could cost them personally.
But the elite nirvana of impunity that has been created as a self-preservation device has led to a massive spread of degeneracy – if there are no consequences, why not do what one feels like? Or even aggressively advocate it? No elite member is removed any longer for degeneracy or because they are a bad example – so they do it. And it is hard to police the commoners once the elites refuse to police themselves.
And here we are – it will take a shattering event to break out of the West’s degeneracy cycle. The enforcement rituals might or might not exist for a small subset of the elite, but the numbers are impossible for it to be a general principle: too many elite people, too much chance for loose talk. The problem is ideologically deeper than a few sick rituals.
Elites have the discipline to enjoy libertine lifestyles without suffering too much damage, proles do not.
Bullshit! They have the resources to buy their way out of or otherwise recover from bad decisions.
organized Jewry
What other kind is there?
‘Mindless advocacy of degeneracy’ dates to much, much earlier than the 1960’s. This started during the so-called ‘Enlightenment’, at the latest. (But really even before than. The Albigensian Crusade wasn’t over trifling doctrinary issues or petty power struggles.)
Yes and no. Doctrine is always of utmost importance. But good that you brought it up.
Organized Jewry refers specifically to the Jewish organizations which promote Jewish interests (as they interpret them) – AJCongress, AJCommittee, ADL, JINSA and so on (and on and on). Not every Jew is affiliated with one of these organizations, so these would be members of that “other” Jewry you’re inquiring about.
would be members of that “other” Jewry you’re inquiring about.
The “inquiry” was rhetorical. Politically, the “other Jewry” that you describe is of no consequence.
Because they fully bought into the idea that all repression was bad. There never was any conspiracy, just a huge paradigm shift in how the elite thought about the mind and the body (both should be subject only to the barest of constraints) and the organization of a healthy society. This is all laid out very well in Adam Curtis’ classic documentary series The Century of the Self. (The name of the third episode says it all, really: “There is a Policeman Inside All Our Heads; He Must Be Destroyed”.)
Repression and societal consequences are two sides of the same coin. In my view the idea that all ‘repression’ is bad leads directly to demand for impunity. This is very utopian, but we now see what it leads to. As with all utopian thinking, it is really dreaming about a bottomless hellish pit.
Dreaming up hyper-permissive societies probably goes back deep into pre-history. What I think was new (or relatively untried before) was the impunity that appeared in the 60’s and 70’s. Even in small ways there were no longer any consequences – e.g. useless males who were cads and refused to raise their children (or to have any), or divorced people – were often penalised previously by a loss of standing. Today we are at the point that this kind degeneracy is celebrated. I have no problem with anyone living out their dreamy life, or throwing it away, but a well-run society keeps irresponsible people away from real influence. I think that is the difference after the 60’s from Enlightement.
The way Cathars were dealt with shows how healthy societies used to deal with degeneracy, elites or not.
Hence the usefulness of a term to describe the Jewry that, politically, is of consequence, which would be Organized Jewry.
Medieval English mobility were totally depraved. So we’re their 18th C ancestors. These things seem to go in cycles. When inequality rises, so does elite depravity.
Then I propose that when you criticize the collection of these Jewish organizations you can just write “Jewry.”
I think that it’s not accurate that way, and apparently many other commenters feel the same, but it’d be fun reading your criticism of “Jewry.”
An iSteve comment on the Epstein suicide watch:
Well, seems legit except for the fact that Epstein was America’s most important prisoner. Don’t buy the dumb midirections and false equivalencies.
Agree with anonymous coward; Epstein was high profile and required a much higher level of scrutiny. I understand this protocol for the next random suicidal inmate (maybe), but Epstein should not have been allowed to go anywhere or do anything without a set of eyes on him even if he was allowed to wear regular clothes. Nothing makes any sense. For example, why would somebody at such high risk (a celebrity AND a sex offender) ever have a cellmate, as Epstein reportedly did?
Epstein had every reason to be suicidal; the prison had no reason to leave him alone unsupervised. The whole thing is rotten to the core.
Most of the organizations that rule (Hollywood, internet censorship, mass media, mass entertainment) are over 50% jewish in the key positions, that means the organization culture is overwhelming determined by jews. The non jew elites are forced to emulate the behaviour of the jews, they may be pretty much the same but they are absolutely not the ones in charge.
Do you think that if say feminists decided that supporting BDS was good for female rights they would ever have a chance to win that battle against the Israel lobby?
High profile prisoners don’t have a different set of rules. They might be treated differently due to corruption or biases, but that’s a different thing. The suicide watch was not done by some hyper-competent intelligence agency, but by ordinary underpaid unionized prison wards who are used to literally sleep on the job.
You all are basically begging the question: first assume that the guy was an important clog in a vast conspiracy, and then proceed from there to “prove” that he was a conspirator, when in fact he could’ve been a bullshitter who had some whores. Maybe all those important and rich clients made sure he didn’t make videos of their short-lived romances with the underage girls. Apparently the claim that he had videos of lots of rich and powerful guys came from Virginia Roberts, who is a highly unreliable witness, to say the least, and probably only reported what Epstein told her. (Sure, the super-conspirator told his 17-year-old whore about his super-secret schemes.)
I think that there are some conspiracies, but most bad things are out in the open, like Jews “conspiring” openly to change US foreign policy. These are transpiracies rather than conspiracies. The elites are highly incompetent, and believe most of their own ideology.
You are assuming too much. We in fact have a few historical examples.
The leadership of Nazi Germany consisted of literal Nazis, and they literally believed in Nazism. They didn’t bullshit the hoi polloi, to the point of many of them literally fighting to the death or committing suicide along with their Führer. Did Goebbels, the propaganda mastermind, lie? Sure, he did. But at the core, he didn’t: he mostly believed the ideology himself.
The leadership of the USSR is an even better example. In the 1930s Molotov and Stalin wrote lots of letters, cables, etc. to each other. In none of those documents do they ever mention fabricated evidence or shooting innocents. Their communication is in fact disturbingly consistent with a sincere belief that they were executing hundreds of thousands of “traitors.” Whenever someone intervened in favor of a high profile specialist needed for the Soviet economy or military (especially in 1941 needed for the war economy and the reorganization of the military), Stalin always seems to have inquired whether the person in question had confessed or not. Those who hadn’t, had a good chance of Stalin deciding that maybe they were innocent, after all. But those who had confessed had slim chances. Why would Stalin do that if he knew that all accusations were bogus?
Another example is the late USSR. By the 1970s the USSR leadership had ample information about how the American economy was pulling ahead of them, and how they couldn’t keep up in the technology race. The KGB prepared reports for the Politburo about American high technology and how it was years or even decades ahead of Soviet technology, and how a lack of incentives (i.e. communism itself) was often to blame for that. And yet the language of the late USSR leadership implies that they kept talking Marxist-Leninist lingo among themselves. They never seemed to question Marxist-Leninist ideology. This, by the way, is one big reason why Gorbachev was such a fool. He was probably a sincere Marxist-Leninist believer, and didn’t understand that the system (and the country itself0 was only kept together by brutal violence, or the explicit and implicit threat thereof.
Even in less modern cases, where the thoughts of the elites are less well documented, we have little reason to doubt that for example medieval kings believed in Christianity, or Chinese mandarins in Confucianism.
Why do you think Western elites are any different? They obviously mostly believe their own ideology.
I don’t know truly elite people (except by a very broad definition of the word), but I know many highly intelligent people who believe all of these points. What makes you think that it’s impossible for the elites to believe them simultaneously?
They had an empty continent all for themselves undisturbed by any powerful rivals. It would have been difficult for them to screw it up. Arguably they might yet manage to do that with the ever increasing multi-kulti craziness.
the banking mafia are parasitic – their continued existence requires the corruption of the political system.
it’s no different from Al Capone corrupting Chicago politics just on a larger scale.
except it didn’t for most post-war history because it depended entirely on whether the media decided to report it or not – hence why control of the media is so important as they can cover up whatever they don’t want people to know.
social media has made it possible for regular people to go around the media wall and accuse people the media had protected.
(imo it’s one of the reasons GOP politicians are so pathetic – they know the media will destroy them for any slip-up whereas Dem politicians know they’ll be protected.)
I think that it’s not accurate that way, and apparently many other commenters feel the same, but it’d be fun reading your criticism of “Jewry.”
Jews are, as a group, one of the most, if not the most, organized (organizing) groups in the world and have been for a long time. They literally have ten thousand and one organizations centered upon Jews and Jewishness. That’s why I have written that “the alt” needs to take a few pages out of their book. They have a modern problem in that what it means to be Jewish has evolved to mean, for all practical purposes, being a Zionist. I accept that there are some “Jews” who are not motivated by Judaism, nor do they have any connection to other Jewish people or organizations, in which case, it is difficult for me to consider them as “Jews.”
sociopaths get a kick out of transgressing taboos and getting away with it.
i think that’s a large factor – the worse the taboo the bigger the buzz they get from transgressing.
part maybe but US politicians wouldn’t have paid much attention to that if it wasn’t also being pushed by the globalist faction
http://www.ozpolitic.com/album/forum-attachments/1388803086684.png
another factor was the empire’s problems in the middle east and wanting to negate hostile “crusader” propaganda by siding with muslims against christians.
What? No. The guy was at an immense risk because his case is so important, with a boatload of media attention. Of course prison authorities take risk and notoriety into account.
Nobody said anything about a ‘conspiracy’ yet, though letting such a prisoner die points at willful negligence, and, indeed, a ‘conspiracy’.
Doesn’t matter. But being in the media spotlight does.
Clark had a Methodist mother and a Jewish father. His Jewish father died when he was two years old, his mother remarried a Christian who formally adopted him, and he was raised as a southern Baptist in Arkansas. He wasn’t even told of his Jewish descent when he was a kid.
You would be surprised at how they don’t (and, how low level workers doing multiple overtime shifts have the capability of f*cking up, even on seemingly important cases).
The fact that you take this position is itself evidence that the position you take is probably wrong, given your track record of being wrong most of the time, on everything.
I wouldn’t completely rule out a conspiracy, given the sheer number of powerful people with strong motives involved in this case. But it’s likely just mistakes and incompetence.
How many low level, not trustworthy types in the prison system will have to keep their mouths shut for the rest of their lives if the conspiracy is true? If there area lot of fatal accidents and above -average suicides involving prison staff chances of a conspiracy increase. But don’t hold your breath.
Does not matter, being jewish is ultimately a racial identity, their “religion” was simply a set of rules they created to protect their race.
Clark is jewish, he gets automatic Israel citizenship because of his race, if it is good enough for Israel to consider him a jew then it should be good enough for you.
Yet he was one of the most evil man of the late 20th century, a true low life.
Do you know who else is a Methodist? Yep, Hillary. The freaky quasi-Welsh do-gooders with their schoolmarmish piety, ugly women, and prematurely aged men. When one digs into American-led malevolence there always is a sh..t-preaching Methodist there somewhere.
True, in stable times ideology and greed always combine, from church hierarchy to communists, from oligarchs to mullahs. I heard stories about latter-day commie apparatchiks complaining about the lazy proletarians because their tennis courts were dirty. (Then they figured out that they can go and play in the West and the rest is recent history.)
Intelligence is about an aptitude and ability to think. It doesn’t actually account for a major part of mental life that is observing and seeing what is around us. Only when engaging one’s intelligence with reality we get some understanding.
My experience with higher IQ, yet die-hard “Russians are meddling and invading” people is that they choose not to care to apply critical thinking. It either mostly benefits them in some way or they simply don’t care enough. In that way modern Russophobia – I don’t know a better term – is different from traditional hatreds like fearing Illuminati, Papists, Anglo oligarchs or anti-Semitism. With those there is an element of magic, all-powerful and largely invisible forces, people put a lot of thought into it, almost too much. But the hatred of Russia that has so spectacularly blossomed in the last 5-10 years is a throw-away and unexamined emotion – it is at its core very intellectually lazy. The willfully unexamined nature of Western Russophobia is what makes it so dangerous – it nicely matches the emerging shallowness in all areas of Western civilisation.
Surprisingly, I agree with you here. Generally true comment about Methodists. The young Bush, responsible for the Iraq war, was a convert to Methodism (by his Methodist wife). Though Hillary was not ugly, just average. Neither was Laura Bush ugly.
Clark can be explained by his being a Methodist, not by his being of Jewish descent.
Why would it be surprising? If we would agree on everything we would be mentally ill :).
One point: Hillary was below-average and dropping fast. A Methodist preachy woman has to be above-average to be bearable and she clearly wasn’t for Bill.
Laura Bush killed a teenager when young (she was drunk in a car), a very Methodist crime. They pray and then they kill, absent-mindedly and with no remorse. An essence of American Empire. But she was ok looking, Texas girls usually are.
Perhaps it is just the short haircut, but I have the impression that she would look a lot more handsome as a man.
It could be argued that starting in the early 19th century Jews started to emulate the behaviour of our home-grown western elites.
The question is whether there’s a particular mindset that is characteristic of elites in general and of our modern elites in particular that was always going to turn out this way. Keep in mind that the undermining of western European Christian society began in the 18th century, at a time when the elites were almost entirely gentile.
In Australia we have very few Jews. Our elites are exactly the same as yours. Our film industry is just as Woke. Our cultural elites are every bit as crazy. You don’t need Jews to end up with hostile crazy elites.
Were they really? I’m not saying you’re wrong but what do you base this claim on?
If a person is Christian or Hindu (in their religion), then are not allowed to immigrate to Israel by Law of Return criteria, despite having Jewish nationality or roots. E.g. https://www.timesofisrael.com/stymied-by-bureaucracy-a-ukrainians-3-year-aliyah-limbo/
And descendants would technically lose their right to immigrate to Israel by Law of Return, if you converted to another religion.
In reverse, if one of your grandparents had converted to Judaism, then you would be eligible to immigrate to Israel, even if you yourself are the atheist.
I.e. Someone from 100% Christian ancestry, who had one grandparent who converted to Judaism, would be eligible to immigrate to Israel by Law of Return, even if they themselves are atheist.
So Law of Return depends on religious criteria, but can be passed to the grandchildren. At the same time, it is lost by converting to another religion.
–
Weird about Israel’s immigration structure, is that religious criteria only applies to one person for each family who immigrates.
Theoretically, Putin’s daughters could probably immigrate to Israel (they seem to have Jewish ancestors through their mother). If they immigrate to Israel, they would have to say they are atheist (if they say they are Christian, they would be banned). However, Putin could himself then immigrate if his daughters would, and be religious Christian without being banned.
Or Trump’s daughter could immigrate to Israel (she is converted to Jewish), and then Trump and Melania Trump would be eligible for immigration. They could be Christian, and would be allowed to immigrate through her – but if Trump’s daughter said she was Christian, they would all be banned.
This is how they create permanent employment for Israeli immigration lawyers.
They sure do.
To understand the Epstein saga, it helps to know what the Western elites believed in when he came of age in the 70s. In Sweden, the hight point of postwar libertinism was the 1976 Sexual Crime Inquiry (set in motion four years before, so its suggestions are more reflective of the zeitgeist in 1972), which recommended that incest be decriminalized, that the age of consent be dramatically lowered, that most cases of pedophilia go free of punishment, that harassment and “mild” rape go unpunished (e.g. when the woman “was letting herself in for it”), and that the penalty for “severe” rape be mildened. When its recommendations were published in 1976, however, the public mood had already swung in the opposite direction, and it suddenly saw fierce criticism (especially from feminists). But the spirit in which it was conceived, I think, lived on well into the the new millennium, which is why the #metoo campaign sometimes seemed such a clash of cultures.
Not bad looking by any stretch, but the very definition of a plain Jane. Bush the Younger, on the other hand, must have been an absolute ladykiller.
https://media1.s-nbcnews.com/j/newscms/2017_19/1213394/jenna-bush-hager-parents-adoption-today-tease-001-170510_b5955999cd9b5a4447bd965b58083e6b.fit-560w.jpg
There you have it. 🙂
Pop quiz on critical thinking: if it was O.J. Simpson instead of Epstein, do you think anybody would have let him die?
Can you read? Try reading my comment again.
Precisely zero will have to keep their mouths shut. The conspiracy is aiding and abetting wilful negligence, something that the diverse prison guard posse is naturally apt to engage in anyways.
Or do you think killing Epstein required a crack team of Mossad navy elephants? It’s not rocket science.
Australia follows America’s lead even more than Britain. It’s political and cultural elites are well down the food chain. If America flipped and went full ethnonationalist Australia would probably go the same way within a decade.
The Iraq war was a Methodist war! Jewish neocons were just scapegoated by a notoriously anti-Semitic American media and public. Glad that’s cleared up.
In Wesley Clark’s case he probably wasn’t motivated by his later discovered Jewishness – or Methodism. Clark was a long time notorious brown-noser who said and did what he had to to advance his career. He even started schmoozing with Michael Moore and the anti-war Dems when the Iraq war became unpopular in his ill-fated run for the presidency. Obviously being a brown-noser in the US means toeing the Jewish line on most issues, most of the time, but in Clark’s case it was just naked ambition not ethnic Jewish interests.
Religious Groups Issue Statements on War with Iraq [19th March 2003]
https://www.pewforum.org/2003/03/19/publicationpage-aspxid616/
The only ones supporting the war are the Jews (though Reform Jews hesitantly) and Southern Baptists.
In response to Beckow’s strange accusation about Methodists not caring who they kill:
https://www.christianpost.com/news/united-methodist-bishops-renew-opposition-to-iraq-war-3929/ [November 2005]
Yes and no, depends how deep you want to go. There are certain mainstream American Protestant denominations, Methodism specifically, that combine ignorance of the world, preachiness, self-affirmed humanism, American exceptionalism, and a disregard for consequences of their actions. You can detect this tendency way back and it has grown over time.
Of course others, from Jewish neo-cons to endless other ethnic lobbies take advantage of this. But there is also something wrong with the people they take advantage of, their inability to be normal is what is at the core of modern American dysfunction.
There would be no war on Iraq without both neo-cons and their ‘Methodist’ enablers. Or on Yugoslavia, Syria, etc… Don’t let the ignorant, clueless, and yet superbly self-confident Methodist do-gooders of the hook. It takes two to lie.
USA – Christian Right is neither.
No room for any actual personal convictions in this view, I take it.
Err, sorry about that. A wealthy female relative married Charles Wesley and bankrolled his preaching thereafter although she herself never entirely converted remaining a Primitive Methodist. My part of the world has contributed an unfair share of leading edge Protestants.
I don’t know if Iraq was a Methodist war, but I know why it was attacked. Because the 9/11 “conspiracy” demanded that an Arab state should be attacked – any Arab state would do. Iraq was attacked because among other reasons, the neocons thought that Iraq had a proven quality of a punching bag, based on the “successful” 1st Iraq war in 1991. Boy, where they wrong.
“The whole thing is rotten to the core.” – Absolutely, and reiner Tor is full of crap. Epstein Affair seems to make some characters here at UR to show their true colors.
“Boy, [were] they wrong.” – No. They accomplished what they wanted to accomplish (the Yinon Plan) which was destroying semi-secular quasi-functioning Muslim states in ME. They did Iraq, Libya and Syria. All former client states of USSR that by the logic of their system of Arab socialism were a threat to Israel and the neoliberal new world order. Now they can keep them destabilized for ever by beefing up the weaker sides in the never-ending internal sectarian and ethnic conflicts.
Looks like the Church of the Latter Day Sovoks does not kill Methodists.
Treatment of prisoners, even, perhaps especially Royal ones. Richard II being one example. Edward II another. Isabella had far more deaths to her name than just Edward. King John famously walled Maud De Braose which even the other Barons thought was doing too far.
Now those are examples of elite discipline. Committing such horrors for your side.
A dog can have both fleas and ticks, you know.
If the guards didn’t like him and weren’t motivated to hang out with him, there would be no difference in terms of level of neglect.
I dealt with a very high profile criminal case once (won’t say who, but politically connected) and there was no special treatment by prison guards, I’m surprised there was no completed suicide (yet). No special conspiracy or willfulness is necessary for gross neglect in that system. Unionized, overworked people is enough.
Again, given the nature of Epstein’s case, I wouldn’t rule out a conspiracy. But I don’t think it’s likely.
Should have been:
Looks like the Church of the Latter Day Sovoks does not like Methodists.
He sounded like a different person depending on the dominant narrative of the moment. When neocons were (rightly) being blamed for Iraq he took pot shots at them and even Israel, but on other occasions he sounded like a typical Amen corner politician. Clark came across as a not quite ready for prime time all round grifter, but maybe I’m wrong and he was playing 4D chess I just couldn’t follow. Unlikely though, as his star would not have faded so quickly.
Also, in a somewhat related note, Madeleine Albright also supposedly discovered her Jewish roots late in life and IIRC it was around the same time as the Kosovo bombing campaign. I don’t believe her late life Jewish discovery story though.
Who knew there was such a powerful Methodist mafia right under our noses this whole time?
Seriously, within both American conservatism and liberalism Catholics have had far more influence than Methodists. And Catholics are nowhere near as influential as at least one other group I can think of.
You are mixing institutional platitudes with what actually happens. If any Methodist bishop or minister truly believed in that ‘peace‘ stuff they constantly talk about, all they have to do is openly confront members of the Methodist Church like Hillary who are on a bloody warpath. If they don’t, the platitudes they repeat are worthless.
My point is that there is a mainstream American ideology that has evolved over 2 centuries that has at its core ignorance of the world, exceptionalism, preachiness, disregard for others, incl. bombing them for the ‘own good’. Methodism is a perfect example of this way of thinking.
Remember the movie “Love story” with Ryan O’Neal and Ally MacGraw? Great movie, with one of the stupidest lines ever seen in a move: “Love means never have to say you’re sorry”. Similarly, being an American means never have to say that you’ve lost a war. If you lose a war, just declare that that was your goal all along – to lose the war, and voila – you are a winner, because you’ve accomplished your goal.
From what I’ve learned of the US prison system (admittedly all second-hand) guys of Epstein’s notoriety are always kept in protective custody unless they specifically request otherwise. Being both a celebrity and a sex offender makes him doubly vulnerable and it would be very strange to put a guy like that with a bunkmate unless he were at one of the facilities specifically designated for sex offenders (which he wasn’t). That aspect alone strikes me as highly unusual.
Yep. We do whatever the Americans do.
Up until the 80s there was still a healthy amount of anti-Americanism on the Australian Left. Of course in those day we had an actual Left in Australia.
“… guys of Epstein’s notoriety are always kept in protective…” – Obviously. Besides this was not on ordinary county jail but federal jail in NYC. Nevertheless something compelled our reiner Tor to speak with confidence and authority on matters he has no knowledge whatsoever. As I state in my comment #142 the Epstein Affair does things to people. They come out from a deep covers and stick their neck out for the cause of obfuscation and minimization. I did not know though I had sone inklings that reiner Tor was one of them but now there is no doubt.
For a Latter Day Sovok you are clever, Cyrano, but it is not like that. The fact that operation Iraq was a success is kept form the mainstream news and the population is made to believe just like yourself that it was a failure because no democracy was achieved and so on. The system is strong enough that it can handle it. Besides this also primes the people to be ready for a future similar operations of bringing happiness and democracy to others. The idealism is the strength that you Sovoks never understood because you were always jaded and burnt out. The cynicism of KGB operatives because a common attitude among the population and that is what killed the Sovok system.
Maybe the fall of the iron curtain was a factor, too? The threat of communism might have been a common bond between high and low, it ensured a modicum of consideration for the masses. Afterwards they felt free to do as they please.
historically elites have often been morally corrupt themselves but yeah they almost always preached socially conservative values to the lower classes to maintain social stability so what’s happened post 1960s is strange and unusual.
the timing correlates with the domination of culture by TV so a simple explanation might be the people who came to dominate TV after its invention were different from the average e.g. more promiscuous, more homosexual, more contrarian etc. than the average.
it could be people attracted to showbiz have always been that way but back before TV wandering troupes of actors and musicians didn’t have the same cultural influence.
a counter to that might be it wouldn’t necessarily matter if the people working in TV/cinema were more degenerate than the average if the owners weren’t as they could block it but then maybe the same argument applies i.e. maybe the people who are attracted to the business side of showbiz also choose that path cos it’s full of attractive young people willing to prostitute themselves for a career?
that would seem to fit the #metoo thing.
so i think the simplest answer is technology changed and that change allowed a previously buried aspect of human nature to become culturally dominant.
(there are other explanations but this is the simplest imo – every piece of new tech solves some problems and creates new ones)
personally don’t think the Jewish aspect is important with Clark – the quote is the relevant part – Clark strikes me more as the military type to believe and repeat BS moralistic rationalizations invented by cleverer and more evil people
“we are trying to transition to… etc.”
(which we?)
my point was the attack on Serbia suited various big agendas so was unlikely to be swayed much by lobbying from small countries except as an excuse.
1) anti-russia: Serbia being historically a Russian ally
2) globalist: multi-ethnic states
3) neocon: blood sacrifice to the muslim world to appease unhelpful AQ style “crusader” rhetoric
No “mafia,” these guys just happened to be Methodists. Methodists and Baptists seem to heavily involved in activist politics.
In addition to Hillary, Bush and Cheney are also Methodists. According to wiki, “Cheney is a member of the United Methodist Church[189] and was the first Methodist vice president to serve under a Methodist president.”
::::
Elizabeth Warren is a Methodist also.
You are very bitter because the Americans played an important role in vanquishing your beloved Sovok system.
It doesn’t mean that you are completely wrong – you are not. I think that Anatol Lieven’s take about the Scotch-Irish influence upon the American political tradition is more on-point than yours.
Good comment. “Failure” of course depends on perspective. Stalin was a massive failure, whose policies enabled a much smaller nation to nearly conquer his empire and to kills tens of millions of its people in the war. But he consolidated his regime’s rule and against nearly insurmountable odds kept an iron grip on power over this country, so he was wildly successful.
The Iraq war was a debacle for the USA, its people, and the West (though not nearly in the same league as Stalin’s effects) but worked out nicely for the neocons and Israel.
Since I like poetry and we are discussing Iraq, I would like to post this one:
The Minotaur Speaks
https://darkreformation101.wordpress.com/2017/06/04/the-minotaur-speaks
Some people aren’t shills, but they will parrot the party line shills peddle. Humans are social animals, and the more gullible of us will be drawn to repeat whatever shills say, simply because the shilling is socially engineered to draw in gullible people.
You saying that he is downstream form some shills? I would give him more credit. His defense “Move along, nothing to see here.” of the status quo was a bit too vigorous.
You may check this three part write up on organized crime in connection to power in the US leading to Epstein.
https://www.mintpressnews.com/shocking-origins-jeffrey-epstein-blackmail-roy-cohn/260621/
http://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/jeffrey-epstein-rip/#comment-3385598
https://www.mintpressnews.com/mega-group-maxwells-mossad-spy-story-jeffrey-epstein-scandal/261172/
And also recent two pieces by Ron Unz:
http://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-the-power-of-organized-crime/
http://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-john-mccain-jeffrey-epstein-and-pizzagate/
I see the relationship of Australia to America the same as Manchuria to Imperial Japan. Australian elites are American elites, which thus makes them (((Australian))) elites. Australia in no way is an independent state or nation.
This is a marginal website that appeals to an audience of people from the margins of society. The idea that anyone, anywhere, would care enough about the opinions of the readership here to actively try to influence them must be the most fanciful of conspiracy theories.
I did not know though I had sone inklings that reiner Tor was one of them but now there is no doubt.
I knew that was him that I saw every month in the shekel collection line!
Precisely why this site has a full-time shill brigade. The ‘non-marginal’ media is already under the firmest of control.
Look at 8chan if you want examples of what happens when ‘marginal media’ is ignored by our current-day potentates.
The cost paying shills is infinitesimal, the possible risk of thoughtcrime breaking free from ‘marginal’ media is quite large. Shilling makes sense from a risk mitigation standpoint.
Slow down. The idea here is that all sides of an issue should be considered and examined. Status quo has the same rights. And vigour has nothing to do with it, we all have our own style.
It is a slippery slope to always read into a discussion some assumed ‘motivation’, or shilling. Those are not possible to establish given the constraints here. So why do it? Whenever you don’t address the points and descend into speculating on motivation you are probably losing the argument. Same goes for your obsession with ‘Spovok’ or whatever. Before my time and I genuinely don’t know what it is and don’t care.
Address the points – it’s interesting enough, leave any potential motivations to gods.
Who are the shills?
Can you give a commenter as an example?
Don’t care to catalogue or study this for more than 30 seconds, sorry.
But ‘AP’ is definitely one. Maybe in pair with ‘Mr. Hack’, though with that character it is less certain.
USA.
https://twitter.com/davidfrum/status/1161596662164230144?s=21
No comment.
What allows the elites to rule over us is consent. Consent that they are superior to us in intelligence, knowledge, moral values etc. In most cases this is false, but the consent is still there. People like to believe that their leaders are better than them.
Communist leaders (Staling included) did their mass atrocities out of insecurity, because most of them were former bums. They were unsure whether their population thinks of them as “better than them”, whether they accept them as their legitimate leaders, that’s why so many atrocities were committed.
Agree with the second part, but the first is only partly true.
You can be sure that most of Conservatism Inc. are regular Steve Sailer and John Derbyshire readers. They were both booted off National Review, yes, but that’s no reason for any one reader to stop reading someone. Would you stop reading Caitlin Flanagan, say, if she were booted off The Atlantic? There is also plenty direct evidence that they are Unz readers (e.g. Ross Douthat of NY Times namechecking Sailer in some way that gives his reading habits away).
The impressive record of being wrong continues.
For a more exciting take by a “former CBS News exec producer”, you could try this tweet, which begins “Narativ has independently confirmed Jeffrey Epstein works for Israeli Intelligence”. Since the former producer himself has a clearly Israeli name (though his immediate past places him in Canada), the plot thickens…
The pitch is that Epstein invested in an Israeli call-center startup that will actually be a vehicle for spying, and ultimately that (later tweet) “Russia Saudi Arabia China and Bibi’s Israeli government” “attacked America in 2016 and are trying to drag us into another war”.
I’m not sure where this claim lies on the spectrum of spy-backed misdirection, opportunistic factional warfare, and idiosyncratic conspiracist monomania… but you must admit it’s not trying to put you to sleep. (Though how Israeli-Arabia and Sino-Russia could be working together to produce, presumably, a US-Iran war is a bit mysterious.)
Reiner tor’s response was vigorous and amazingly stupid for any grown man. Of course it reveals something about him. Utu is one of the best commenters here. He searches for truth, is a fiercely independent thinker and panders to no one. Does his research too, and shares the links.
You seem to have given some thought as to how best attack his (admittedly scathing) takedown of RT. The somewhat condescending “tone” of your answer is good and of course utu does ad hominem. Ad hominem is both relevant here and entertaining to read. Plus, I save time by knowing whose comments not to read or read at my own cost.
Florida lawyer who represented Jeffrey Epstein victims says he isn’t convinced the billionaire pedophile killed himself because he was ‘too vain’ and always defended what he did
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7357743/Lawyer-represented-Jeffrey-Epstein-victims-doesnt-think-killed-himself.html
Jeffrey Epstein was in ‘great spirits before his death and thought he’d be bailed out’, as it’s claimed he was taken off suicide watch after telling lawyers injuries from his ‘first suicide attempt’ were inflicted by cellmate
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7358577/Jeffrey-Epstein-great-spirits-suicide-death-thought-hed-bailed-out.html
It’s pretty easy to detect a shill:
a) They’re constantly online, like it’s their full-time job. (Hmmm….)
b) Their opinions are always in lockstep with the globohomo/deep state party line.
Food for thought: for all of “AP”‘s purported nationalism, has he ever said anything that even mildly implies thoughtcrime against the holy doctrines of homosexuality, feminist diversity and anti-racism?
If I had dirt on dozens or hundreds of very powerful people who each wanted me dead, was in a prison cell with very little chances of getting out alive, and just last week there was an attempt on my life, I’d also be in “great spirits,” I guess.
At least the konspiracy kookery should be kept consistent. Saying that he was “fearing for his life after the last attempt on his life” would be more believable.
If your point was simply that it was quite possible that Epstein was murdered, then I wouldn’t have an issue with it. It is, after all, perfectly possible. But Konspiracy Kooks have to go way beyond that. You guys say that it was patently impossible that it was murder.
I was skeptical of the murder theory because of a high profile suicide (which, by the way, could also have been murder) of a psychopathic murderer in Hungary, where the incompetence of the Hungarian justice system was almost beyond belief. Almost, but not quite, because, from what I heard, it was quite a bit believable.
https://hu.wikipedia.org/wiki/M%C3%B3ri_bankrabl%C3%A1s
https://hu.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nagy_L%C3%A1szl%C3%B3_(b%C5%B1n%C3%B6z%C5%91)
So that’s why I copied in the comment from iSteve, which is from a guy who knows something about the American justice system. I also read a little bit about American prisons. Their system seems to be more violent than the Hungarian one, but not much more competent.
I notice that the guy who advocates “punching right,” often writes unreconstructed Nazi stuff, literally expresses joy at the thought of a nuclear war between Russia and Israel, vigorously attacks HBD (using his pro-Nazi “street cred” to appear as a genuinely right-wing attack on it), is well known for his ad hominems (though often writes some arguments, too), in other words, the guy whose comments are not conducive of a normal discussion, is now spreading Konspiracy Kookery. (In fact, you often do that.)
Konspiracy Kookery in small doses might be useful against TPTB, but in bigger doses it’s usually just a distraction from what I call “transpiracies,” i.e. conspiracies which are pretty transparent and done in the open. It’s well documented that influential Jews want to use their money and power to hijack American (and in general Western) foreign policy for the benefit of Israel, and then call it a “conspiracy theory” for anyone who criticizes or even mentions it. It’s a pretty low hanging fruit to take, because it’s done out in the open.
But Konspiracy Kooks have to distract us from this, in order to pursue some Big Sekret Konspiracy from a stupid Hollywood movie. That way they can both misguide us and make us look like idiots to normies. And in fact, we’d certainly be idiots if we uncritically swallowed these stupid theories.
People who call the neocons idiots are idiots themselves. The Iraq war was a huge success, then they even followed that up with Syria and Libya. The rise of Iran and the axis of resistance, with the entry of Russia back into the Levant, is a problem but they have achieved so many goals that you would think were improbable to achieve. It is doubtful they could have done much about Iran and Hezbollah anyway.
Sorry chum but I am not from the fringes of society, the readership here has always been of a higher quality.
The point with Epstein is he should not have been able to commit suicide so it is at best a crime of omission. The only thing that might take it out of the nefarious is the sheer incompetence of the people of colour who run the facility, the warden is a typical AA Black woman promoted way above her ability. Cui bono?
Worth repeating, not for the willfully ignorant, but for the benefit of others.
Wrong as usual.
I have made 5 comments a day on average in August. In July I averaged 7.6 comments per day.
This is “full time” in your world.
I’m not as interested in those topics as I am in Eastern European ones. However I have noted that Intermarium is pleasantly Muslim-free and socially conservative a number of times.
Both you and utu are among my favorite commenters.
I, in no way, meant to disparage. Indeed, the high quality of the readership here is precisely because it consists of those from the fringes. There’s a reason we use the term “normie” as a pejorative.
There’s also the possibility of murder, of course. I read now that some of his injuries (broken bones in his neck I believe) were consistent with him being strangulated. Though they were also consistent with him hanging himself.
Perhaps fringes of the bell curve. Most of us seem to be sucessful.
I think you are right, but considering the bizarre tastes and lifestyles of people like Epstein and Podesta, I sort of understand why Alex Jones-style beliefs spread in certain circles.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7353967/Did-Jeffrey-Epstein-portrait-Bill-Clinton-blue-dress-red-heels-NYC-mansion.html
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2019/08/14/22/17289660-7353967-image-a-26_1565818437820.jpg
https://www.thesun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/NINTCHDBPICT000513560561.jpg
speaking of conspiracy theories the arms, legs and hands on that painting look female – didn’t Hillary take trips to the island also?
if you scraped off Bill’s head would Hillary’s be underneath?
The Comintern was dissolved in 1942 by Stalin. The last head of the Comintern was Dmitrov.
Good day on the stock market!
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-08-16/trump-panicked-stocks-fell-called-top-3-bank-ceos
When I read such a rubbish either from misinformed foreigners or from usual Serbian psychos, I’m always glad we got rid of Serbs. There is absolutely zero rationality among Serbs (now & then, I glance at Serbian newspapers & videos). It’s a lie combined with autism & all wrapped in paranoia.
What is good is that all those things combined prevent Serbs from: a) being seriously taken by “the world”, b) fills them with horror of us, Croats, to such a degree & profile that it paralyzes them of doing anything even semi-rational that could hurt us. True, there are Croatian idiots who are obsessed with Serbs- but they are a marginal minority.
I am thankful to God- if she exists – that we’re free from that lunatic east. Sure, we got problems, but we’re light years ahead & I’m optimistic re future.
Libya , Greece/ economically /, Yugoslavia were destroyed to establish free ways for Islamic occupation of the EU. And to establish the Muslim states. Bosnia, Albania..And more military bases in EU..
First- Serbs are obsessive & almost completely irrational. This is basically a cognitive dissonance (this thread having virtually nothing with them or dissolution of Yugoslavia).
But, although ironic, your question can be hesitatingly answered: perhaps yes. I’ve read on Serbian forums & newspapers about many cases of disappearing children. I don’t know if it is statistically per capita more or less the same as in the US, or poorly governed countries like Brazil, but this is a phenomenon much more pronounced in Serbia than in neighboring countries.
I don’t think it is about Gypsies (you can’t count them, anyway). But it could be connected with corruption: it seems that a part of new- borns are pronounced dead & then sold for adoption to couples in the West (white babies are not as cheap as Asian, while black are for free); in case of 3-15 years age range, it could be anything from simply bureaucratic errors to kids flying from dysfunctional home to white slavery.
The last is even more frequent among Albanians.
Are you are from the Balkan Peninsula, or just interested in their history? I thought before you were maybe English or German.
No, I am a Croat & live in Croatia (being of a few different ethnic extractions, but this is irrelevant for the topic).
From the outside you two look indistinguishable.
BTW, the dumbest politics-related thing I’ve ever heard came from Croatia, when I heard the Cyrillic alphabet called a “genocidarski alphabet” or however you spell it in Serbocroatian.
From the outside water & vitriol look indistinguishable.
The weirdest thing about that painting is that it’s obviously traced from a photograph. (!)
Sometimes the easiest shortcut, the quickest fix, is to believe, or at least profess to believe, the official story.
Anatoly Karlin and Bo Winegard are both white supremacists. RationalWiki will continue to expose right-ring white racists.
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Bo_Winegard
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Anatoly_Karlin
Is this a joke?
Or are you saying we should not read articles by WHITE SUPREMACISTS because you say so?
I tried to comment multiple times in the Open Thread – and it said I have a limit to 3 comments for an hour for a thread?
What is this stupid new rule? If you don’t remove this, it is almost enough justification to cause people to leave the forum (what’s the purpose of a forum where you cannot write multiple comments in an hour and write a discussion with people responding to your comments in real time?).
Ron Unz is too old to understand how internet commenting works. Or rather is supposed to work.
Probably indefatigable kooks like Wally are his target.
Let’s hope AK and Audacious Epigone raise this issue with our fearless overlord.
Are you from the old-stock Armenian diaspora of the Yugoslav region?
I used to be more sympathetic, but in my experience there are very few nationalism’s more irrational, jingoistic, intransigent or aggressive as Serbs.
Croatian Nationalism is hardly any less cancerous than Serbian either. Croats do hold a significant amount of blame for setting off the whole post-Yugoslavia in the first place. Unlike Albanians Croats can’t seriously claim to even have been persecuted or marginalised. Opportunistic scum on their own side knew what they were doing when they awoke old hatreds. They made their bed.
Agree x100.
There already is conspiracy theory, that Epstein’s death was faked, that the public was shown body of recently deceased actor Anthony Bourdain. The most plausible part is their argumentation, that Epstein must have collected tons of kompromat, and if he wasn’t complete fool, he would arrange it to be published in case of his death/disappearance.
Jeffrey Epstein’s parents were Seymour Epstein who was a groundskeeper for the New York City Department of Parks, and Recreation and School aide and homemaker Paula.
He got hired at an elite school and taught there even though he had no degree or teaching credential, then worked at Bear Stearns where he was a tax dodging specialist who was especially good at dealing with super rich clients before being sacked for misconduct. Then he was a very highly paid consultant to Steven Hoffenberg at Towers Financial Corporation, but left a few years before it was revealed to be a Ponzi scheme fraud that had bilked investors out of half a billion.
Then he met Les Wexner who gave him power of attorney over his vast fortune which Epstein proceeded to steal a huge chunk of, and used to make a pig of himself starting with models and then with ever younger girls having sex (or rather mastrubation sessions) from them 3 times a day. He then began donating to obscure scientists especially Martin Nowak a German Catholic who thinks inclusive fitness/ kin selection is of little value as a way of looking at the world. After Epstein’s child sex habit was exposed by a Palm Springs high school catfight and local cops, Wexner divested himself of Epstein and discovering that that he had embezzled vast amounts of Wexner money, demanded it back, with just just one repayment coming to 50 million dollars. Epstein’s promised science philanthropy payments virtually ended. But he still knew a lot of people and he continued to mix with them.
And Brockman continued to promote Epstein after his conviction. Finally, Epstein was re-arrested due to a Miami reporter’s stories,and died, not in a plane crash, boating accident, or autoerotic asphyxiation misadventure, but only after weeks in Federal custody. Weeks when he might have said anything to investigators, or anyone.
It is being reported that a Vanity Fair story about Epstein depraved behaviour was cancelled about 2002 after a bullet and a decapitated cat were left on the editor’s doorstep . I see the Epstein saga as indicating a lack of discipline among the elite. It is surprisingly easy for a free-riding con man to talk his way in, make raids on their money, and create havoc. But then successful people tend not to see conspiracies behind every anomalous occurrence.
there was probably an incident involving a minor which was made to go away in exchange for him working for them as a procurer and brothel keeper – hence the job offer at the school.
(whoever “them” are)
the rich dudes who want these kind of services (whether for blackmail purposes or for themselves) have a great deal to lose if they get caught so they use cut-outs.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cutout_(espionage)
they want the kids filtered by a cut-out so only the ones least likely to speak out are passed through to the final clients.
this for example would be a perfect cut-out story if it was one.
i guess you’d have to know if Wexner’s activities as boss of Victoria’s Secret when he was younger would was consistent with that or not.
Epstein is the ultimate litmus test.
Elites gave up trying to civilize and make better the little people a long, long time ago. They figured out you can’t teach stupid how not to be stupid. They previously tried to “tutor” the little people into becoming mature, civilized intelligent adults, but they gave up when they figured out it was pointless. They based this on their experience of teaching their own toddlers. Because their toddlers quickly mature out of their toddler states and start to become independent, intelligent and to figure out solutions to their own problems, elites assumed that it would be the same with the underclass: teach them, show them the ropes and then quickly they evolve into something much better. Unfortunately, this does not happen with the underclass. They remain always stupid and unable to grasp simple concepts, do not learn from experience, cannot help themselves but to act on impulse and are unable to delay gratification, have violent tendencies, etc. They remain toddlers for life. So elites gave up.
The problem with the relationship between elites and the little people is that the basis of any relationship is reciprocity and symbiosis(mutual benefit). From the moment you must relate to someone that you must dedicate time, effort, money and they not only do not give anything in return to you, but instead actually make your life worst and more dangerous, that is not a relationship, but rather a form of negative obligation at best and coercion at worst. Elites like everyone else with their kids have this relationship with their toddlers, but they expect the toddlers to grow up and give them something in return, like helping them when they are old, etc. There is no such benefit in doing this for an adult that will always remain a toddler.
From the point of the elites, all the underclass can offer them is very simple unskilled labor. The elites can do the jobs that the underclass can do 100 X times better than the underclass, and can do 1,000,000 X more things than the underclass even knows exist or can be done. The simple unskilled labor that the underclass has to offer is very, very little in value compared to the massice amounts of problems that they cause. When a member of the elite is robbed/murdered/raped, it is by the underclass. The underclass litter streets, create epidemics of drug abuse with huge medical costs that have to be payed by elites, their filfth spreads real diseases and they make cities ugly with their trailers, projects and slums. Even their general manners and behavior are disgusting by elite stadards: they are loud, vulgar, lack even the most minimal consideration for the rights of others, will do things such as yell expletives and four-letter words in public, roast barbecue in public parks and don’t even clean after their mess, etcetera.
From the point of view of the elites, the udnerclass has a lot of “cons” with very little if any “pros”. And since a lot of their deficiencies in cognitive ability and ethics appears to be innate, since you can’t change then, the elites have developed not only indifference but flat out distate for the underclass and a desire to get rid of them. Even their morals seem to be hardwired and difficult to change. No matter how many times a criminal from the underclass is sent to jail, he comes out and does it again. Even when the lesson to be learned is very simple, so simple that even someone from the underclass can underrstand(“You steal from others, we punish you.”), they still don’t learn because they have enormous difficulty in delaying gratification or feeling empathy for the people they are hurting. So elites figured out that the best solution for the underclass is to isolate them in ghettos, remove guns from everywhere except from those ghettos, stop the police from confiscating the drugs going into the places where the underclass lives, and making the underclass dwindle by allowing them to kill themselves with violence and drug overdoses. A good friend of mine, who is a Harvard PhD in biochemistry and a member of the elite, actually told me that this is the plan:
“in the long run, it is the best solution. These people can’t be helped.”
And becsause elites tend to be either agnostic or atheistic, they don’t feel like they have an eterneal obligation to serve those who are below them when they give the elites nothing but rape, theft, murder, squalor, dirt, misery and decay of infra-structure and their cities. They are fed up with underclass pultritude. Elites are deeply moral: most members of the elite will never steal from others, or rape, or kill, or even punch someone in the face. But they lack Christian guilt over not helping those who brings us nothing but suffering and pain.