HABBENING: #23январяЗаСвободу Protests

RT journalist Bryan MacDonald collating protest turnout data – mostly from Kommersant, a paper that is marginally opposition-leaning, but by not means pro-regime.

https://twitter.com/27khv/status/1352892347730845696

Data from Far East and now from the Volga suggests 0.2% of population is protesting in the more “agitated” cities, this tallies with my prediction this will be bigger than ~7,500 at NeDimon (2017), but smaller than ~60,000 at Bolotnaya (2011).

Journalistic coverage following typical post-2012 pattern: Hacks & activists gushing about unprecedented numbers based on nice ground-level camera angles, while bird’s eye view photos decidedly less impressive and concordant with objective estimates of attendance.

Note that Saint-Petersburg metropolitan area has 6.5 million people. 5,000 people attending according to Kommersant.

Haven’t seen any estimates for Moscow yet, but to be fair, it looks like the only legitimately “big” protest (if still highly modest relative to the 15 million people it its metropolitan area).

Probably at least the 15,000 people that I predicted:

Here are some literal children (anyone remember онижедети?):

https://twitter.com/czartube/status/1352939097812295682

Twitter is pushing the #23январяЗаСвободу hashtag on me, because Qanon Shaman is on the “correct” side here.

 

Anatoly Karlin is a transhumanist interested in psychometrics, life extension, UBI, crypto/network states, X risks, and ushering in the Biosingularity.

 

Inventor of Idiot’s Limbo, the Katechon Hypothesis, and Elite Human Capital.

 

Apart from writing booksreviewstravel writing, and sundry blogging, I Tweet at @powerfultakes and run a Substack newsletter.

Comments

  1. Please keep off topic posts to the current Open Thread.

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  2. Felix Keverich says

    Twitter is pushing the #23январяЗаСвободу hashtag on me, because Qanon Shaman is on the “correct” side here.

    It’s the same with Youtube: if you live in Russia, Navalny’s videos will be your ‘recommended’ list. ‘Recommended’ videos automatically score millions of views, so it’s direct competition between Navalny and cats.

  3. Protesters treated with kid gloves by Moscow police. But the fanatics don’t consider anti-Navalny protesters worth of free speech, beating one of them into unconsciousness. (In fairness, some of the brighter ones tried to stop it).

    https://twitter.com/iremeslo/status/1352959866785116166

  4. Bashibuzuk says

    Navalny Live video about the protests, put online an hour ago (already more than 5 million views):

    https://youtu.be/cDSdvNAub24

    In Russian only.

  5. Pretty easy to clock up millions of views when you have Google’s algorithms on your side, back in the real world – it was a damp squib (as was clear to me from the start).

    But hopefully this causes the kremlins to finally awake to the threat of having the discourse within their country set by a platform controlled by a hostile foreign Power.

  6. The Spirit of Enoch Powell says

    Is there any real way of preventing “globohomo” from spreading without North Korea levels of censorship?

  7. It is the persecution of The Horned God.

  8. Journalist on the scene: Most police polite and professional (unlike in Belarus, which he also personally covered); 30-40% of participants in Moscow are schoolchildren; some liberal journalists participating in the protest (e.g. yelling out slogans). https://twitter.com/Alexey_Larkin/status/1352989127608848384

    Я в центре событий на московском навальнинге. Пока перерыв поделюсь впечатлениями, тезисно. На 17:30, из того что видел и снял лично я (допускаю, что многого не видел и могу изменить мнение, увидев всё с другого ракурса)

    Во-первых, несмотря на то, что я идейный ACAB, я должен честно отметить, что полиция вела себя достойно. На мой субъективный взгляд 80% сотрудников отработали идеально. ОМОН не лютовал при задержаниях, заблудившихся вполне вежливо выводили к ограждению, на некоторых участках стояли офицеры, которые позитивно и вежливо общались с людьми. При мне сотрудник потеснил человека к выходу, тот криком спросил “Че ты делаешь!?” и сотрудник извинился и вежливо указал человеку на выход. Я видел это своими глазами.

    При этом 20% сотрудников (опять же субъективная пропорция) вели себя как мрази, с криком “Сука” бежали в толпу и месили людей дубинками. По таким людям потом оценивают всех остальных, считаю, что им не место в органах.

    Вообще, по сравнению с Белоруссией наша полиция просто зайки. И протестующие, в целом, тоже. Силовиков закидывали снежками – выглядело это конечно унизительно, но все же безопасно.
    UPD: под вечер отдельные мудаки стали кидать бутылки и дымовые шашки. Полиция все равно пока не жестит. 17:30 время.

    Среди пришедших примерно 30-40% были школьники. На разных участках по-разному. Школоты было очень много, но говорить, что “выходят школьники, а взрослые нет” не совсем правильно.

    Очень много демшизы и неадекватов. Кроме либеральных психбольных присутствуют ровно того же качества шизоиды из НОДа и За Правду. Шизы крикливые, но не особо буйные – в драки не лезли, провоцировали мало. Были шизы со змагарскими флагами, кричали “Живе Беларусь”, также были их коллеги из Украины, кричали на мове. Очень много цветноволосых феминисток и мальчикой гомосексуального вида. Не осуждаю, просто констатирую.

    Кто-то из протестующих облил омоновцев краской. На мой взгляд поступок сам по себе недостойный (облиты оказались и силовики и люди рядом), но кроме того это еще и разозлило сотрудников, дало им повод действовать жестче

    Видел либеральных журналистов с пресс-картами и в жилетах, которые кричали лозунги и в целом участвовали в митинге, а не просто освещали его. Ребят, вы не коллеги, вы пи*арасы. Боретесь за “прекрасную” Россию, а сами наё*щики бессовестные. Из-за вас под омоновскую дубинку попадают настоящие журналисты.

    Вот такое пока мнение, читайте прямую трансляцию @stormdaily, там вся информация, фото и видео!

  9. Probably 20,000 in Moscow, quite close to my 15,000 prediction.

    https://twitter.com/27khv/status/1352992185793339392

  10. It’s been fairly obvious even in the US that Google/YouTube is in bed with the DC establishment – including the state department/FBI/CIA – in efforts to boost pro-establishment voices and suppress anti-establishment ones.

    This would obviously be worse for countries deemed legitimate targets of the US establishment.

    The Kremlin can use the same philosophy being proposed in the US of associating any riots against the establishment as “insurrection”. (This is also why Navalny quickly condemned censorship of Trump because it was clear that the Kremlin could use the same justification to censor him for protests/riots/violence that he incited.)

    If the two cases of violence – one against an anti-Navalny protestor and another against an FSB agent – are true, the Kremlin could – following US establishment logic – pin in on Navalny for inciting the violence.

  11. Yes, at least this is funny. Btw. noted Navalny supporter without facemask; Ukronat. with masks on and khuilo chant – have reasonable and witty stance.

  12. Yes, it’s interesting that the khuilo chant includes both Putin and Navalny. Perhaps, this indicates that the crowd is aware of some sort of “Navalny as technical opposition to Putin” scheme that’s been floating around for several years? I don’t know, as I point out to those around me who also express these feelings, it’s hard to believe that Navalny’s poisoning was faked. On the other hand, why would he return to Russia? And around and around it goes…..

  13. Does QAnon have a position on Navalny?

  14. Mr. Hack: Realy not very sure on any of your points.
    As for khuilo chant on Navalny and Putin together there can be two explanations: they hate every Russian (simple approach), or the “technical opposition” point of view, you mentioned. From Ukraine I have been in direct/closer contact only with people from Transcarpathian region, mostly of Rusyn ethnic origin, methink. And they are rather reserved, distant from these big scene developments and ukronationalism.
    As for poisoning – my guess it was hardly complete fake, but who did it, how, why – we will not know any soon or never. With western alleged and “highly likely” novichok narrative – after all the narratives of Saddam WMD, only Serbs bad in Balkans, etc. in mind, I would be very reserved too but “competencies” of Russian secret service cannot be underestimated too.
    My point – watch it as a part of big theater (not particular Bolshoi Theatr/Большой театр).
    And again I admit that this time (first time?) ukronationalists made me cheer with their chanting.

  15. I have been familiar with the “Rusyn” political landscape in the past. What’s new in that world? It used to be that you had two basic groups, supported by outside infiltrators. There was the Father Sidor and Petr Getzko group, that was clearly financed by the Politburo, trying to drive a wedge between Ukrainians and “Rusyns”. Then there was the Hungarian brand of Rusynism, supported by a strange dude named “Zhalyva” and a couple of other old and unemployed sovoks. Then there was the cleverest one of all, a Canadian professor of Ukrainian history, a Paul Magocsi, that made a lifetime career of trying to sell his own brand. He’s highly disliked in Transcarpathia and rarely ever goes there, wisely trying to avoid the mistrustful and vocal antagonists that are loathe to embrace their “liberator” from the Canadian northland. It’s always been a three ring circus there. Oh, and the last that I was aware, it seemed that the hardcore Ukrainian nationalists like Right Sector, were the most popular group there. 🙂

  16. AnonfromTN says

    Journalist on the scene: Most police polite and professional (unlike in Belarus, which he also personally covered); 30-40% of participants in Moscow are schoolchildren;

    Well, there are several tens of thousands of fools in Russia willing to openly show their foolishness. That’s fewer than I expected. Most of the fools are young, many just post puberty. Reminds me of an American joke:
    Young people think that old people are fools, but old people know that young people are fools.

  17. AnonfromTN says

    On the other hand, why would he return to Russia?

    That’s an easy one. Where else can he earn a living? He is good at nothing, so his only potential source of income is handouts from the State Department, or CIA, or MI6, or Mossad. But he can get those handouts only being inside Russia. Outside he is totally useless to his paymasters

  18. Alexei Navalny exposes Instagram of Putin’s secret love child

    Poisoned Kremlin critic Alexei Navalny continues to be a thorn in the side of Russian President Vladimir Putin after unearthing the Instagram account of the strongman’s purported 17-year-old love child, according to a report.

    Putin, 68, has been linked by Russian outlet Proekt to Svetlana Krivonogikh, a cleaner who is worth more than $100 million and lives in a posh area of St. Petersburg.

    The teen’s Instagram followers jumped from 17,000 to 42,000 in a matter of hours as she lashed out at her jealous “haters.”

    “Wow, I can see a sweater paid for by my taxes. How many pensions does this sweater cost?” one user commented, the Sun reported.

    “What do you say in school when they ask you: ‘Who is your father?’” another said.

    Another offered the zinger: “What is it like to be born with Putin’s face?”

    https://nypost.com/2021/01/21/alexei-navalny-exposes-instagram-of-putins-alleged-love-child/

    So the situation is more serious than Karlin thought. Navaly is shitting on Putin and keeps humiliating him. He has all the West behind him, media, spooks, etc. Now we will understand if Putin is in charge or not.

  19. Shortsword says

    These rumors have been out on the internet for a few months at least so it’s nothing brand new.

  20. Yes, her account got leaked months ago. There is some resemblance to Putin.

    If true, good for him – she inherited a nice sense of aesthetics. https://www.instagram.com/luizaroz_/

  21. I have the feeling that there will be more things popping up as Navalny has connections with all the necessary spooks.

    The context – look at the corrupt, unfaitful Putin and his illegitimate children living in luxury, vs the poor russian population – it is a strong context too.

    Make no mistake, an attack has started on Putin and Russia. Just in time for Biden’s Presidency to escalate further the hybrid war against Russia.

  22. It’s not going to work. They added some more documentary evidence and the propaganda push is real (70 million views on YouTube, LOL), but none of the revelations are new, there are few Putin supporters who will be tilted into turning against him by this.

    https://twitter.com/akarlin88/status/1353030263362748426

  23. Imo it is a part of larger scheme of things, probably they had information that Putin intends to stay in 2024 and they want to derail that, causing problems in Russia, to force successor infighting, etc.

    The successor infighting actually is their chance.

    The 2021 – 2030 period is critical for Russia, after that the West will be too weak to make too much trouble. Especially the 2021 – 2024 period is important, when the West is still stronger and the successor issue is still not resolved.

    They need to destabilise and possibly take over Russia before it forms itself as a strong pole in a multipolar, non-western dominated world.

  24. Bashibuzuk says

    Navaly is shitting on Putin and keeps humiliating him

    Exactly what I was writing about.

  25. Bashibuzuk says

    Yes but Проект people didn’t show the face of the girl. Navalny did. Perhaps in the next video they will show Kabayeva’s sons. Then they will show when they live, what property they have in the West etc. They are ramping the pressure against Putin. If he does nothing about it,,then he shows weakness.

  26. Shortsword says

    He’s already been doxed, apparently he’s a Dagestani Islamist.

    I didn’t expect that type of person to be in a pro-Navalny protest. Maybe he just wanted a fight?

  27. Bashibuzuk says

    Even prison did not break this guy. More respect for him then for fighting against the OMON. That’s the difference between a warrior and a geek. The warrior will go all in, the geek will analyze the situation and find a thousand reasons to avoid fighting. There was a time Russians were warriors…

  28. Russians are warriors, you are taking on the biggest Empire the world has ever seen, in a fight for the planet’s future. You should be proud of that, and never lose hope. And you have my support. The future of the planet depends on you.

  29. Given his record, I assume the next punishment will be much longer, as a recidivist. He was born in 2000. He’ll now probably spend more or all of his 20s behind bars.

    But sure, he’ll have his 5 minutes of Internet fame from the Russian pronouns people on Twitter. Chad af.

  30. Soo… it looks like it’s over? At least for now, in Moscow? The total turnout for the country was what, around 50,000 (roughly)? Vs how many YouTube views and other social media activities? 74M? So again, very approximately, 1:1000 ratio of muscle in the streets to Western media activity. I think it will be an important metric to watch as Biden administration will attempt to turn Russia into next Libya/Ukraine. US is running out of time as Chinese are gaining fast, so US needs to destroy Russia some time in this decade in order to create a northern flank, or at least scorched earth that Chinese can’t rely upon in the final showdown.

  31. Its not over yet, after Navalny gets jailed for several years (i’m 90 % sure of that) then things will get interesting. This will trigger joint US/EU sanctions and more protests on the streets. His wife will probably take over (Belarus Scenario). Nord Stream 2 could be cancelled as well, Gazprom is already hinting about that possibility. We will see.

  32. it was a damp squib

    If it was going to work, this would be a strange world. If 25,000 – or even 100,000 – demonstrators in a big city can change governments it would be absurd. That is true in Russia as much as in US or France.

    So why are they doing it? Some marginal PR for the West at home. And there isn’t much else they can do. West keeps on retrying the same old methods that have ceased to work after over-use (and bad experiences afterwards). Publishing dirt on enemy leaders is a dumb move, it doesn’t work. This is run by people who lack real experience, probably the new generation of NGO trained “revolutionary” consultants.

    As Passer By wrote, 2021-24 is crucial: the gradual weakening of the West and gradual strengthening of Russia-China requires a deus-ex-machine moves, something has to give, otherwise in a few years West will be forced to settle for worse terms. Navalny and gang are not effective. West will have to for the jugular or give up. It could get scary, or comical – the current Western crop couldn’t find a jugular if their lives dependent on it.

  33. These protests may not succeed and maybe neither will the next, but eventually something will stick and the chauvinistic, slav-centered Russian regime will fall and be replaced by something more palatable to the international community. Once Russia is brought to heel, her racist institutions dismantled and her jingoistic populace subdued, the specter of white supremacy will be extinguished forever from this world. Russia represents the last viable white power center and its subjugation will remove whatever feeble hope white racists may have for the continued independence of the white race.

  34. Since you know so much about the topic, care to share with us your own take on his recent poisoning?
    My own theory is pretty much premised on Sherlock Holmes’s famous dictum:

    When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth

  35. Daniel Chieh says

    Russians are POC.

  36. 4Dchessmaster says

    The thing is, I don’t even believe Navalny is a threat. Can anyone really tell what he stands for?

    All I ever hear from Navalny is “Putin bad, corruption bad”. It is so boring and stale that I hardly doubt he would ever be able to pull a 1917 even if he were given all the tools and support to do so. He is too incompetent and buffoonish.

  37. sher singh says

    Bro, stfu vivek. Looking at your comment history, it’s the same guy.

    Nigga, stick to one name with your dindu cuck takes.

  38. I’m not so sure about that. Single fighting won’t even win battles nevermind wars. Organization matters, and Dagestani and Chechens are effective because they are highly familial/tribal. A single Chechen is worthless, a tribe of them working together is a different story.

    The fact that this guy wasn’t covered by his relatives means he is not good and his family disowned him. Which is probably good because if it were otherwise, OMON would have to bring out flamethrowers and it would get messy. Unlike US and BLM fires, Russia doesn’t have infinite USD to repair $billions in city damages caused by PR stunts.

  39. The Jews are no less powerful in Russia than they are in the United States.

  40. Gerard1234 says

    LOL-what time are you finishing sucking Navalny’s d*ck?.

    He could easily have just released this “investigation” before intended arrival in Russia you idiot. This scumbag has deliberately exacerbated the situation by compounding his deserved arrest, with the BS “Palace” video at the same time. Under foreign direction this tramp has engineered a situation to create some anarchy, all for the purposes of avoiding jail, NOT showing bravery you cretin.

    The facts are that he 2 times failed to report to FSIN as part of requirements for his suspended sentence. This should have jailed him but didn’t. Then there was the comedy poisoning where ( contrary to the BS spread by liberast imbeciles) the authorities allowed him to not return and report back to FSIN because he was “recovering” from the fake poisoning. When he then restarted doing his “investigations” in Germany, the authorities had no option but to stop viewing him as “recovering”…. and demand his immediate return – that he failed to do.

    In addition to that violation we have the most OBVIOUS case of slander in history by Navalny against……. a WW2 hero, and the most blatant misappropriation of funds from his so called anti-corruption organisation where its quite blatant that his travelling, clothes, properties, kids holidays, kids foreign educations are way in excess of his stated income…. and that’s without even thinking about his ” Prince of Liechtenstein” ( or it is Luxembourg?) POS deputy Volkov, who is even more obviously corrupt.

    Does even a demented human as yourself not want to question WHERE WERE NAVALNY’S KIDS during these western-sponsored protests?

    LOL- calling out for schoolkids to break the law ( well, 1.1% of them hahaha), falsely promise to pay their fines…. but somehow the children of his, the daughter an adult I think, are nowhere at the protests.
    Where were they? On holiday in Puerto Rico? Their father ” falsely imprisoned”, great optics for their western prostitute backers if arrested, inciting children to commit crimes…… but they are nowhere… e xept able to carry on expensive lifestyles in expensive Western universities as others suffer.

    It’s been a great day with great comedy for Russia. Beautifully perfect policing, comedically low turnout to support their hero, “70 million views” shown as contemptible BS.
    The only problem is the story of FSB patriot possibly losing his eye after a scumbag Navalny-whore attack. I pray to God it is not true about his eye ( doesn’t look like anybody could have gouged it, but possibly windscreen shattered causing possible eye problem)

    It isn’t relevant if fair or logical….. if the FSB guy loses an eye……. I am holding YOU responsible.

    Some dumb bitch stood in the way of police walking an arrested man into their vehicle in Saint Petersburg. She stepped into their line of walking to nonsensically ask why they arrested him. Quite beautifully, one of the police kicked her. He has to think of his safety first. Completely textbook policing.

    If anything bad happens to that guy in his employment or legally… I am again holding YOU responsible.

    Cretin

  41. Shortsword says
  42. People focus on Navalny like he is shiny glitter and that is wrong. The ultimate objective is succession because Putin is not forever, and he is taking his time nominating a candidate. If you can alter the perception of the elites, you can make them a good deal (in infinite fiat USD) and you can get them to defect. Protests are just a cover story.

    What will happen is US will try its best to humiliate Russian government on international and domestic Russian stage, and convey to the elites that they are better off selling out than pursuing an independent course. Russian oligarchs will be quite receptive, but to convince security services, US will need to convince them that serving under Putin course of action is neither prestigious nor profitable.

    So expect massive provocations (to the point of killing Russian government officials Suleimani style) against typically cautious Putin government. If security service get disappointed and demoralized, oligarchs will do the rest, and color revolution will come to Russia.

    And if Putin retaliates, well, my game of “get Joe Biden to nuke something” will be in play.

  43. Shortsword says

    Nord Stream 2 could be cancelled as well, Gazprom is already hinting about that possibility. We will see.

    The status of Nord Stream 2 doesn’t depend on Russian actions. Maybe EU puts out some insane terms that Russia has to abide with to get Nord Stream 2 finished. But that’s politically the same as cancellation. It’s mostly United States and Germany deciding this.

    There are reasons Germany want Nord Stream 2. About half was German financed but perhaps more importantly Germany doesn’t want a situation where USA can cancel Germany’s trade relations and international economical projects because of American geopolitical goals. Much of Germany’s potential growth comes from trade with China and Germany doesn’t want that squandered.

  44. Warriors come in many different shapes and sizes. I would say this one falls in the dumb grunt category. I do respect that aspect of it, but he happens to be on the “enemy” side. If you know what I mean.

  45. Daniel Chieh says

    So expect massive provocations (to the point of killing Russian government officials Suleimani style) against typically cautious Putin government. If security service get disappointed and demoralized, oligarchs will do the rest, and color revolution will come to Russia.

    That would be insanely risky, no?

  46. AnonfromTN says

    I don’t claim to know all that much, I did not live in Russia since 1991, and I visited Russia only three times since then.

    However, if you want to find out the truth, I think you have to use the approach that predates Sherlock by centuries: Roman cui bono. The whole poisoning (that did not really poison) circus was likely arranged by Navalny handlers in CIA/MI6/Mossad to raise his visibility. He was gradually losing appeal in Russia, had to resort to sexually half-mature schoolchildren, because his “narrative” was too silly for adults. Considering that his approval hovered below 5%, current 15% who believe that he was poisoned by the regime is a huge leap forward.

    Personally, I think that if the regime really wanted him poisoned, he’d be poisoned and dead within hours. The fact that this circus went on for many weeks, with him allowed to go to Charite and then return, clearly indicates who “poisoned” him, and it wasn’t Russian regime. I must say that CIA/MI6/Mossad handlers are trying to get as much as possible out of week hand they’ve got, but it’s still a weak hand, and it won’t be winning.

    They need to invest in a more substantive and credible figure than Navalny. Their problem is that only worthless nonentities are for sale, and anyone of any worth in Russia would be their enemy. Tough luck.

  47. “The Kremlin can use the same philosophy being proposed in the US”

    They can arrest and debrief opposition activists every 30 days and threaten them with mandatory multiple vax “treatments” from the red vial…the one with the active aids virus or nanobots. Easy for the media to cover up. Covert death by lethal injection. The USA/NATO/USAID might well be moving to do just that in America…perhaps against right-wing gun owners, or anybody else deemed not economically viable, or not Zionist enough…or whatever.

  48. Single fighting won’t even win battles nevermind wars.

    Agree with that.

    Dagestani and Chechens are effective because they are highly familial/tribal

    Yes and also because they are willing to fight. They don’t look for excuses. If they have to fight, then they just do. If they have to kill, they just kill.

    A single Chechen is worthless

    Disagree with that. A man willing to fight is never useless. A crowd of cowards is less useful than a single man willing to fight.

    this guy wasn’t covered by his relatives

    We don’t know his story. We don’t know how he got in the demonstration and we don’t know why he started throwing punches.

    Besides, a lot of Russian families won’t cover their relatives in a fight and it is even worse in the West. In the West probably the majority of your relatives won’t come and help if you have to fight someone. Best case scenario, they will call the police. Worse case they will ignore the situation entirely.

    OMON would have to bring out flamethrowers and it would get messy

    OMON are not some Spetsnaz. They are good at beating up unarmed demonstrators. Not sure about them prevailing against armed DICh militants.

    Bottom line: one should not look for trouble, but endlessly avoiding trouble at any costs and always counting on cops for protection is a loser strategy. This is what happened to a lot of Russian civilians in Chechnya in 1992 and it ended up as extremely unpleasant for tens of thousands of them. They hoped for state protection and they got none, Chechens used brute force and killed and enslaved them at will, like cattle.

  49. BTW, I don’t know if I asked you before, but any thoughts on what happened in the Yushchenko non-poisoning/”poisoning”?

    That’s one thing where I get annoyed with the authorities – the failure to give an official position on things like that, “fraud” in the failure Orange revolution, MH17, Skripal. Litvinenko etc.

    Western people who follow international news are total imbeciles, Russian authorities showing that we did not do a crime (even if it is entirely credible, as for all those examples) is not the same as saying who in our official opinion, actually did do it. Westerners won’t accept a denial, without a direct accusation to go with it.

  50. Felix Keverich says

    Not at all risky for the for US. What exactly Putlet is going to do? Poison Vicky Nuland? Ha!

    Insanely risky for the Russian oligarchs, whose assets could be easily redistributed by the next Tsar. This is a country with no functional courts, no culture of private property and oligarchic wealth is still widely seen as illegitimate.

  51. Felix Keverich says

    I don’t know about you, but I don’t consider Caucasians to be humans like us. To me Caucasians are a form of wildlife. While co-existance between humans and Caucasians is certainly possible, they don’t belong in our cities.

    To give you a comparison, placing an agitated male baboon in the middle of that protest would surely produce a lot of chaos. It doesn’t make that baboon a hero, and celebrating his “masculinity” makes you look stupid.

  52. Cmon Karlin…. don’t be a dimwit. You’re a blogger so ACT LIKE A BLOGGER.

    At least show SOME interest in facial characteristics or the girls mother before you go in on this “lovechild” BS.

    Every single photo of the mother circulated in media shows her with the face majority covered with sunglasses – making it impossible to know what she looks like, and so extrapolate what her daughter should possibly look as.

    That is all…. except one……. where it’s clear that the daughter looks exactly like her mother, Svetlana Krivonogikh, who looks similar to Putin ( it’s almost as if some of us slavs in Russia have Slavic features!)

    How dumb is this “scandal”? For the first time on history – no attempt to look at what the facial appearance is of the officially listed parents before claiming “lovechild” LOL.

    It’s also highly insulting to think that security conscious Putin VVP, encourages this woman, not even his mistress, to pleasantly just have a child of his. What is this BS – not Orthodox enough to not sleep with her….. but ultra-orthodox at the point she must have the pregnancy and raise an illegitimate child of his? LOL

    Patriotic media don’t publish proper photo because of justified privacy (just as they do with Poroshenko’s MP son’s wife Russian family in Saint Petersburg)…. but fake retard liberast media only circulate images wearing sunglasses that are as good as a welding mask for seeing what her face looks like! Psyop

  53. Felix Keverich says

    It’s called ‘recklessness’, because that Chechen had zero chance of winning. Caucasians being stupid animals that they are, are unable to anticipate the consequences of their actions.

  54. Armenians much less psychopathic/useless drivers than the other Caucasians – particularly those from Che/Dag/Ing

  55. It’s called ‘recklessness’?
    Is it ? Every bravery is by definition reckless and does not include calculation that your cowardly kind does before taking any action.
    Regardless of this particular event this is the kind of man that the west thoroughly lacks and that is why we are where we are
    For many years we have had scribblers, trolls, meme creators and so on but a true man was nowhere to be found
    An action like this in face of power and adversity no matter how “reckless” means much more than thousands of empty words which this site produces daily
    Word has its role but time has come to add an S in front of it

    “The country is dying cause of an lack of men, not a lack of programms.”
    ― Corneliu Zelea Codreanu, For My Legionaries

  56. Felix Keverich says

    Regardless of this particular event this is the kind of man that the west thoroughly lacks and that is why we are where we are
    For many years we have had scribblers, trolls, meme creators and so on but a true man was nowhere to be found

    You’re welcome to take our Chechens then. That is all I have to say.

  57. We do not view ourselves as Caucasoids, thank you very much. It’s not a coincidence that practically anyone who had a single useful skill in that region before the Russian conquest was Armenian.

  58. As Passer By wrote, 2021-24 is crucial: the gradual weakening of the West and gradual strengthening of Russia-China requires a deus-ex-machine moves, something has to give, otherwise in a few years West will be forced to settle for worse terms.

    On the one hand, the Putin machine managed to deal with the demographic abyss caused by the collapse of Soviet Russia and the roaring 90s.
    https://proza.ru/pics/2019/10/22/1626.jpg

    On the other hand, right now no one is making babies, due to COVID, so 2020 and beyond will be a second demographic abyss.

    On the third hand, in the US, the demographic that made it a world power in the first place–Anglo-Germanic whites capable of improvisation and self-reliance–are disengaging increasingly from what they view as a hostile colonial power structure, while the whites playing for the regime are the bland careerist ones…i.e. the ones that brought about the collapse of Soviet Russia.

    So let’s see, let’s see…

  59. Plastic paddy?

  60. Europe Europa says

    Surprising amount of scenes of Russian police looking on the back foot in the Western media. Police being beaten up, their own barricades ripped apart and thrown at them, being pelted with snowballs and made to look like chumps, etc.

    More what I would have expected from the weak, knee taking British police, not the Russian police with their reputation for being tough and uncompromising.

  61. How is white supremacist when it is BIPOC protestor vs BIPOC police?

  62. How about monetizing his Youpube following? With million views and Youpube’s endorsement he should get some kind of income.

  63. Bashibuzuk says

    They have been told to not exaggerate. But there were a couple occasions when they didn’t restrain themselves. Like the video where an antiriot cop kicks an old woman because she asks why the young man they were escorting was arrested and where the cops were taking him. But overall they did their job without too much brutality. Same thing from the protesters’ side, a couple of excesses, but overall they were well behaved. Especially when you compare with France or USA.

  64. I have the feeling that there will be more things popping up as Navalny has connections with all the necessary spooks.

    This is your feeling or your hope?

  65. The Qanoners who stormed the Capitol were courageous.

    They were morons too, TBF. But they were at least doing it for a righteous cause, trying to “take their country back,” whereas this Islamist is just a useful idiot.

  66. I would say the Moscow OMON handled things extremely well – almost no bad optics, it was almost entirely Navalny’s drones chimping out. Almost no instances of gratuitous violence, which contributed to Belorussians seething and continuing to come out for months. The normies will tire of it in a few weeks. The hardcore will be ID’ed and progressively arrested, charged, and locked away.

  67. Sergey Grigorov pegged you perfectly.

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Esc0Gl3XcAAUjpV.png

  68. If you check my long term comments, you would know that it isn’t a “hope”, lol. If i was you, i would not ask useless comments about someone but simply check their comments to see what their views are. Which are quite, quite pro-russian.

  69. Shortsword says

    Do you know the numbers of police killings and police killed in Russia? In the United States the police has a somewhat justified paranoia of getting shot which results in them being very trigger happy. I don’t think that situation really exists in Russia.

  70. If Russian liberals ever take over the country will probably implode. Either a civil war or a full take over. Then Crimea given up, Donbass given up, Osetia – Abhazia given up, Belarus given up, Kaliningrad given up, possibly Northen Caucasus given up, Kuril Islands given up, giving up nukes, a soft dismemberment of the country via various autonomies, and a deliberate program for population replacement and cultural replacement.

    Ukraine, Belarus and Georgia enter NATO, Syria implodes, pro NATO coup in Turkey, Iran under siege, China under siege. Chance for the New World Order taking over the world – 90 %.

    So basically it will mean the destruction of Russia, its culture and people, and handing over the world to the Liberal World Order.

    Thus, whatever Putin may have done, which isn’t much different than other countries elites, the country should not be destabilised over it.

  71. There is one US cop living in Russia i’m aware of and he say russian cops behave better than US cops, he even says they don’t have enough rights. They are not trigger happy.

  72. Bashibuzuk says

    I have a few problems with Pynia, none of which has anything to do with democracy or liberalism.

    1) Pynia is a toxic byproduct of the Brezhnevian stagnation, he is from the generation that betrayed their fatherland and led the generation of their children (that would be our generation) to much unnecessary suffering and abasement.

    2) Pynia is a creature of Sobchak, Chubais and Berezovsky (who later came to regret helping him rise to power). He is a Yeltsin appointee and continued to demonstrate loyalty and respect to Bor’ka alkash even after the alcoholic’s demise.

    3) Pynia might have been a great statesman, a Franco or Napoleon to the humiliated Russia of the 90ies, but he preferred enriching himself and his cronies from Ozero Cooperative.

    4) Pynia employs and promotes to the highest positions the killers of 1993 (Shoigu). Therefore the blood of Supreme Soviet supporters is also on his hands.

    5) Pynia backed down and peed his pants in front of Burkhalter in 2014. He might have saved the Russian speaking Novorossia folks, instead he betrayed them and made their life a hell on earth.

    6) Pynia is Lubavitcher’s kissing buddy and Netanyahu’s good friend.

    He is not the Leader Russia needs, he never was and he never will be. He was appointed to preside upon Russian weakening and decline and his halfhearted attempts at “standing up from our knees ” have only lead to Russia crouching.

    I don’t care for a second about Navalny staying alive or dying (especially since he indirectly contrbuted to Tesak’s death), but I wish with all my heart to see all the kleptocratic Russian elites stripped of their wealth and marched into some beautiful and all natural Magadan working camp.

    Krylov was right: “it is time to finish this strange system “…

  73. Bashibuzuk says

    Putin must be replaced by a more nationalistic and ruthless leader. It must be done ASAP. Russia needs a Franco. They should have done it in 2013.

  74. I dont think the Russian liberals would actually destroy Russia with population replacement. You see, what you have to understand is that Russian liberals are basically concerned about money. They want to have a Western quality of life.

    Sure, they wont be white nationalists and forbid non-European immigration. But it will still be regulated due to the fact the vast majority of refugees and what have you want free money and a free house. Russian libs let alone the Russian population want all of that money to themselves and for their own economic development, not wasting billions on propping up outsiders based on humanitarian concerns like the West has.

    So nah, I cant see the horde descending on Russia anytime soon due to those concerns.

    As for giving parts of Russia away to appease the West, sure there are radical hard core libtards who would love to do that. But they are the minority. The majority along with the established military would not want to commit to such a route. Too much prestige along with no actual benefits.

    Honestly I think there will be something of a liberal push in Russia in the coming decades but not enough to fully globohomonise it.

  75. What? A Franco? A short, hitch-pitched voice, fat-ass, chicken shaped, pin-head for a leader? Can you not think of someone more manly ffs!

  76. No, they will do those things under foreign orders, not because they like some of them. The decline of the West necessiates the destruction of Russia and grabbing as much as possible from it.

  77. Nice dreams.

    The reality is that that the Ukrainians will be given the green light to commence with Operation Storm, the more “passionarny” Russian nationalists will be killed there or imprisoned on coming back to Russia (anti-mercenaries law). Navalny has been quite clear on his views about Donbass supporters.

    Then the racist liberals masquerading as nationalists will be imprisoned under a re-criminalized Article 282. Those who aren’t will in any case be completely deplatformed and rendered even more impotent than they are today. I will derive some satisfaction from that, since even though these developments will be bad for for me too, they will be a vindication of my principle that stupidity needs to be brutally punished.

  78. Gerard1234 says

    Why is everything some annoying reverse question with you?

    In Ingushettia, Chechnya and Dagestan the police are regularly at risk of terrorist attacks and general banditry….. but their rate of killing these swine is far lower than any place in US to their civilians.

    Last year a police officer, in his young 20s asked some scumbag on the platform in the Moscow Metro for his documents ( can’t remember if central Asian or kavkaz) and got shot dead. If the same thing happened in America they would shoot dead 25 ethnics as a proportionate response. In Moscow there was no retribution.

    We have gone from an extremely high murder rate in Russia (many shootings obviously) to a much lower, even European levels in some regions…… and this has occurred without mass jailing and mass shootings from Police as would need to do in US for similar thing to occur.

  79. And how would you ideal Russian statesman interact with the neighboring Ukrainian state? Or would you have him totally disregard and destroy Ukrainian statehood? Give old Putler some credit, he pointed out to George Bush that:

    You do understand, George, that Ukraine is not even a state. What is Ukraine? Part of its territories is Eastern Europe, but the greater part is a gift from us. (Ты же понимаешь, Джордж, что Украина — это даже не государство! Что такое Украина? Часть ее территорий — это Восточная Европа, а часть, и значительная, подарена нами!)

  80. Sure, they wont be white nationalists and forbid non-European immigration. But it will still be regulated due to the fact the vast majority of refugees and what have you want free money and a free house.

    I do not think this is true. Russian liberals are at core Western cargo cultists, always have been, so the classical liberals of yesteryear are already getting outflanked by modern Wokespawn.

    E.g., telling recent example: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/illarionov-has-done-his-duty-he-can-now-go/

    Also no reason not to expect the same system of class status signaling by supporting refugees, Blacks, trannies, Black trannies, etc. that works in the West not to apply to Russia.

    It’s not going to happen right off the bat, obviously, but the underlying trends will acquire an inexorable character.

  81. A couple of things regarding this ‘brave warrior form the Caucasus’

    It is the same bravery as displayed by the guy who ‘eate some lead’ in this vid.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2M23wVhGkNA

    Several more points about this guy. Even professional fighters or ‘serious amateurs’ sometimes brake or crack bones while punching. Of course it is possible to smash a brick or wooden plank by striking it with a fist but those who perform such usually have a lot of practice and do so with carefully aimed and rehearsed blows.

    Now this guy throws punches at a policeman wearing a helmet with facial protection as well as body armour. Here is a little practical experiment: clench your fist, swing your arm and hit a hard surface. Once the pain subsides try to write about your experience – the word ‘try’ is here not by chance because you will be lucky if you still can type.

    The fact that the ‘brave warrior form the Caucasus’ is not wincing in pain after landing the first punch on the ‘cop in armour’ shows that he was very likely as high as a kite. He went down after getting hit with a baton to the head – in such case it is lights out drugs or not.

  82. Simpleguest says

    Krylov was right: “it is time to finish this strange system “…

    What is strange to me is that you, in your earlier comments, lamented the revolutionary dismantling of the then existing social orders (and the states) that took place not once but twice, first in 1917 and then again in 1991.

    You maintained, if I recall correctly, that it would had been much better to retain the state order (and the state), and to gradually reform it in order to safeguard the wellbeing of the population to the maximum extent possible. This is a reasonable approach and everyone would agree with that.

    PS. Your nick, Bashibuzuk, eventually become a synonym for the whole rotting Ottoman empire.
    Even today, people in some places, shake their heads and simply say “a Bashibuzuk” when they are confronted with an undisciplined and unruly mob, or want to describe something that is unable to function in any orderly manner.

  83. I checked some of your previous posts. Perhaps you are one of those Russians that have a bleak view of their own country. If I were Russian I would be proud and positive about my country. Honestly, looking into what has happened in the world during my adult lifetime, two major achievements stand out: fast Russian recovery after the collapse of the USSR and the 90s, and lifting hundreds of millions out of poverty in China.

  84. I’m not russian, but i’m from Eastern Europe and have simpathies for that country. Quite similar culture, etc.

  85. It’s not that it’s embarrassing, it’s that I have better things to do than respond to this primitive gaslighting, sorry.

  86. He looked funny in his middle age but the Generalissimo was a methodical and unyielding kind of guy in rooting out Spain’s leftists.

    Dr. Salazar in Portugal looked and sounded more conventional. Possibly a model for a politician of determined will who doesn’t need to win a civil war but still wants to leave a lasting effect on their country.

  87. Bashibuzuk says

    You maintained, if I recall correctly, that it would had been much better to retain the state order (and the state), and to gradually reform it in order to safeguard the wellbeing of the population to the maximum extent possible.

    Absolutely. This is what I believe. And I think that to achieve this Putin must retire ASAP and be replaced by a more ruthless and nationalistic leader.

    Otherwise Russia would end up exactly as Ottoman Empire did. It will rot and be divided between China and Atlanticist West.

    I have no soft spot for Navalny, I have written that Pevchikh is most probably an MI-6 asset and I do not think Putin ordered an assassination attempt against Navalny (although now that I know that they were filming his “secret palace ” this summer, I start to wonder).

    What I want is a strong enough Russia that would withstand the fall of the West and the rise of the Sinosphere. Putin’s Russia is not strong enough because it is ruled by a kleptocracy.

    Simple, no?

  88. Why “primitive gaslighting”? Bashibuzuk has assembled a list of interesting, if not questionable stances of yours and is only requesting clarity in order to make sure he understands your current opinions on certain issues that may have evolved and changed from those that you’ve held in the past. He seems to have done his homework, and is an honest commentator here?…

  89. He has major difficulties with distinguishing fact from opinion. But no worries, you are both in a solid majority in that respect:

    https://twitter.com/hua_xiaoxiao/status/1353156965652901893

  90. I get it now, this Bashibuzuk is some kind of agitated moslem, that’s why he likes Franco and admires the Chechen cretin arrested in Russia in the mini protests. As to your point about Franco “rooting out” Spain’s leftists, yeah right, that’s why they came in full force after the satrap succumbed to the heavy weight of his ass, with three governments populated by leftists, including the present one.

  91. 4Dchessmaster says

    LMAO, why is everybody overanalyzing this aggressive North Caucasian guy from the protest? Sure, he looks like he can handle himself quite well, but that does not mean he is Khabib 2.0. There is the other side that also demonizes him excessively, which is not necessary. He is just a bored person who decided that throwing punches at cops was a good pressure release for his pent up anger. He is also quite stupid for sticking up for a loser like Navalny who has led “stop feeding the Caucasus” protests and has called North Caucasians “roaches.” It is quite bizarre how both Russian and Western media have zeroed in on a guy who behaves no differently than any other ethnic group in any country in the world.

  92. Peter Akuleyev says

    What China has done in the last 30 years just underscores how badly Russia has failed. The idea that Russia made a “fast recovery” is ridiculous. Russia lags far behind the USSR in education, health care, military tech and even basic innovation in its position relative to the world. The current Russian regime is just a dig and deliver economy stripping off Russia’s natural resources for the benefit of a small elite and enough Muscovites to preserve stability. Any time I go to a trade fair I am embarassed for Russia – Turkey, Poland, and the Czechs have all made great strides and have developed competitive manufacturing and service companies in a variety of industries. Russia can make decent weapons, has some software skills, and that’s about it. Even India and Brazil make Russia look backward these days. Позор indeed.

  93. Typical opinion of a Yeltsin-era emigrant whom the world (and Russia in a particular) has passed by in his late sovok/1990s bubble.

  94. Europe Europa says

    I think in more “authoritarian” countries individual police officers tend to have less rights and personal agency to make decisions. It surprised me to learn that in China the average police officer doesn’t even carry a gun, like in the UK (something very unusual for a Western country). I think the UK leans more towards the “authoritarian” side of things even though most British people have this delusion of their country being some bastion of freedom, the home of the “Magna Carta” and all that.

    This is presumably because the Chinese government does not want to give individual officers the right and confidence to make their own independent judgements on a given situation, which having their own personal sidearm would be likely to.

  95. How about monetizing his Youpube following? With million views and Youpube’s endorsement he should get some kind of income.

    Youtube stats are as fake as the 2020 elections. If the advertisers pay money based on these fakes, they are even dumber than I think.

  96. Thulean Friend says

    The passive-aggressive attacks from AK on his commenters is pretty amusing to watch.

    As for the protests, I think we can all agree that liberals and Navalny won’t be in power after putlet. Navalny’s main function is to weaken the regime. I disagree with AK that putlet’s corruption is inevitable. He brings up examples such as Hungary, but Sweden’s population is similar and while Löfven is a clown, he is definitely not corrupt. Germany’s economy is almost twice the size of Russia’s and I don’t think even the most hostile anti-Merkel shills would call her corrupt.

    The more interesting question is which constellation of oligarchs and power brokers inside Russia promote Navalny and what’s their endgame. There are also concerns raised in the West about Navalny’s racist comments about central asian gästarbetare. Bryan MacDonald even goes as far as calling Navalny the Orban of Russia, which is a novel take. In this view, Navalny is basically LARPing as a liberal to get foreign support, like Orban used to do, and then will change once in office. I’m lukewarm on the theory, but I give some respect to Bryan since he lives in Russia and isn’t a pro-Western shill.

    Either way, I concur with the consensus here that Russia’s transition moment will make it vulnerable, though I expect putlet to play a behind the scenes role much like Deng Xiaoping did after leaving office. I don’t think we’ve seen the last of the wily manlet even once he vacates his formal positions.

  97. What opinions of mine bother you?

  98. Like the video where an antiriot cop kicks an old woman because she asks why the young man they were escorting was arrested and where the cops were taking him.

    They later apologized to that woman. Have you ever heard of French police apologizing to gilets jaunes? I guess that’s the difference between “dictatorship” and “democracy”.

  99. TheTotallyAnonymous says

    That would explain why his and Bahibuzuk’s takes and opinions are mostly so cucked, worthless and just bad.

    I’ve been struggling to understand wtf is wrong with them for quite some time anyway …

  100. TheTotallyAnonymous says

    The reality is that that the Ukrainians will be given the green light to commence with Operation Storm, the more “passionarny” Russian nationalists will be killed there or imprisoned on coming back to Russia (anti-mercenaries law).

    It’s somewhat heartening to see that you’ve learned important lessons from what happened to Serbs in 1991-1995. Although it remains to be seen whether those lessons are understood widely enough amongst Russians …

  101. Felix Keverich says

    The passive-aggressive attacks from AK on his commenters is pretty amusing to watch

    There is nothing passive about it. He straight up puts offensive labels on people, and it’s his preferred method of debating. Called me a “MAGA cultist” among other things.

  102. There are also concerns raised in the West about Navalny’s racist comments about central asian gästarbetare. Bryan MacDonald even goes as far as calling Navalny the Orban of Russia, which is a novel take.

    There aren’t any concerns about that. It’s just some Russians (and people that are pro-Russian) trying convince Westerners that Navalny is racist to “cancel” him. But there are no fair rules to this game so nothing will come of it.

  103. I have clearly stated that I look at the fight outside of the contest of the particular demonstration but in the context of a man ready to fight when when odds are stacked against him with an emphasis of the total lack of this kind of men in West when such kind of man is exactly what is needed (not just another futile analysis of one kind or another)
    The fact that he is a Dagestanee or a Chechen is irrelevant in this context

    As Mahatma Gandhi once said

    “Those who want to live, let them fight, and those who do not want to fight in this world of eternal struggle do not deserve to live”

  104. When he was starting his political career he made some xenophobic comments:

    https://youtu.be/2GGFVOY6_r0

    As posted by Olivier1973 on another thread.

  105. Shortsword says

    Navalny doesn’t have any principles. For the West that’s a good thing.

  106. I’m of two minds of public demonstrations. Crowd size is important but not crucial. It is what the mob is prepared to do and what the authorities do in reaction that matters.

    As a kid I saw massive protests against the war in Vietnam. Hundreds of thousands of people marched on the Pentagon but it was mostly a ‘cheap date’ where young men and women could gather and admire each other.If 250,000 people came to ‘protest’ perhaps only a thousand or two would actually be drafted and sent to fight the war. Other than that life was pretty good in the USA and as Nixon ended the draft and American participation in the war the protests fizzled out.

    OTOH a few hundred negroes, marching across the Edmund Pettus bridge got into a confrontation with Alabama law enforcement in 1965 and one of the marchers was shot and killed. The incident made Martin Luther King an American superstar.

    Russian law enforcement should be on tenterhooks over these protests and not give the demonstrators oxygen. If Navalny had no real support, as I suspect, the protests will evaporate.
    Normal people do not want people with horned helmets and face paint as leaders.

  107. Two things: One, Navalny bears watching, if for no other reason that he has publicly connected himself to the likes of Bellingcat. Two, it would be silly to overreact to his provocations which would only escalate the US-led psy-ops and may lead to the growth of his profile internationally.

  108. Gerard1234 says

    He straight up puts offensive labels on people, and it’s his preferred method of debating

    I completely agree. It’s not right. Karlin’s a disgrace in how he conducts himself on here.

    He’s rude. He’s inconsiderate. Frequently vulgar. A master of long-phrased insults. He doesn’t deserve his own blog.

  109. Well, the man said that the men he supported turned out to be imbeciles, therefore they deserve getting fucked, so the next generation learns not to be imbeciles.

    Simple as.

  110. The instant I heard that Navalny started out as a nationalist and is now a lib I know he’s just Russian Vučić except with a more lib rhetoric (Vučić talks all nationalist, but insufferably melodramatic and pathetic). No principles he just wants power and will do what his tardwranglers (westoid embassies) tell him to do.

    On the other hand I don’t think that tactic can work. Russia is just too big and powerful automatically. Power “corrupts” (more like draws corrupt people to it), and he could perhaps quickly go rogue and basically become Putler 2 who also kinda started as a pro-westerner

  111. Probably. The question is – how much will Russia lose during the interim between Navalny getting into power and becoming “redpilled” on the Western partners?

  112. Bashibuzuk says

    What next generation? The one who will spend their days online in VR and receive MMT UBI ? Don’t think it’s gonna be a generation of geniuses…

  113. Simpleguest says

    This is what I believe. And I think that to achieve this Putin must retire ASAP and be replaced by a more ruthless and nationalistic leader.
    Simple, no?

    Well, this needs to be legitimate i.e. wish of the majority of the people.
    Voting fraud allegations aside, I don’t have the impression that anyone can defeat Putin if he runs for one more term.
    Anyway, I believe that Putin can be ruthless and nationalistic if the situation calls for it.

    You are, of course, entitled to your own opinion.
    I was under the impression that you, in your zest, were advocating a violent overthrow of the current, legitimate president. I wanted to respond to that only.

    Respect for the will of the majority is the cornerstone of the Western efficiency.
    The will of the majority is respected and dutifully obeyed even if it’s a miniscule 0.2% majority.

    Brexit, for example, a monumental historic decision, won with only 4% majority if I am not mistaken. And Brexit it shall be.

    Everything can be fixed if you stick together.
    So simple, yes.

  114. 4) Covid restrictions are justified and those who disagree with them are “subhumans”

    If done properly, as in Asia, and people complied, COVID restrictions would indeed be justified. Justified by the principle that they are effective. Unfortunately the sub-human health authorities never even tried to prevent the pandemic, instead they went [late] for “flattening the curve” and other nonsense which only delays the spread, and ensures we have a large number of strains.

    Unfortunately rightoids simply cannot distinguish between an effective and an ineffective response. So they flail about criticizing the government responses with exactly the wrong reasons, and the response of libtards inevitably leads to a defense of the ineffective government response, even when that’s not the intention. Most perversely, it is the health authorities themselves who are some of main beneficiaries from this state of affairs. Almost no one is blaming them, even though they are the ones most responsible for both the economic downturn and the COVID deaths.

  115. Verymuchalive says

    I must agree with you on this one. I have met these people. They’re still trapped in 1995 or 1990. Often they don’t seem to realise how much weaker America is than then. All very last millenium.

  116. Well, that’s your opinion, and you got a bit carried away with the Brazil and India part at the end. I evaluate highly that Russia could turn direction so swiftly and energetically after the 90s, getting rid of powerful parasites and bad faith advisors, becoming independent in the international arena, conservative in values, and proactive to defend their interests, even offering refuge to the most wanted enemy of the most powerful State, and still holding the power to stop a major war because of MAD. In my assessment all of that was a major achievement, it could totally not have happened and the country would be a vassal state.

  117. Noted. I am not Russian either but I have many Russian friends. The best parties I have ever attended were in Russian houses. That counts for something, in my book.

  118. There’s one popular figure in particular that really continues to push the limp “Navalny the ultranationalist gun nut” line year after year.

  119. I don’t think your question is very useful. Whether any particular response is justified will probably vary from country to country. Whether globalization is justified is a rather abstract question. I would prefer to phrase the question is such and such response effective in X country? In the aging, developed world, a complete non-response would have led to millions of deaths. The current response being taken may also lead to millions of deaths(impossible to say what vaccines will accomplish), or close to, plus economic dislocation. The ideal response would have been shorter and much firmer, in particular it would have involved non-voluntary quarantines, border closures, and would not have led to so many deaths.

    I’m not convinced market capitalist globalization is going down either. Probably market globalism will accelerate in the sense that financial elites are going to massively expand their ownership of important assets across the world. Buying of distressed property for example is going to lead to much misery. If I were to project current trends forward(extrapolation however is not always sensible), I would suggest that people who are workers in a single country are going to suffer heavily while those with financial assets in different countries will benefit, even more so than was already the case. If I were to extrapolate it looks very much like we’re returning to serfdom, minus the farming.

    I’m not too confident in any of these predictions however. Whether COVID will have long-lasting effects on the organization of the world economy or will prove to be a short-term panic which sets back the economic prospects of people over a period of say 5 years or less is unknown. It is worth discussing though.

    One thing I am pretty confident about is that most people aren’t going to learn the right lessons from the pandemic.

  120. Shortsword says

    Putler 2 who also kinda started as a pro-westerner

    He no doubt had the full intention for Russia to economically join the West. But he did publicly express dissaproval of American foreign policy. Especially in the middle east after the Iraq war. That made many neocons really angry. It makes you wonder, would there be any difference if Russia had instead acted like Poland and tried to please America as much as possible?

  121. AnonfromTN says

    would there be any difference if Russia had instead acted like Poland and tried to please America as much as possible?

    Moot point. An elephant cannot behave like a mouse, even if it is willing to and tries hard.

  122. OK, I’ll humor you. Come to think of it, my “ideology”, such as it is, is opposition to morons of all stripes.

    1) US election was not stolen. (Ron Unz would disagree about that).

    As I recall, Ron was likewise skeptical that voter fraud is what tipped Biden over the line. His point was that it was Big Tech’s suppression of the Biden laptop story that did it. Maybe – maybe not, it did end up a damp squib after all. Bannon at any rate was more interested in posting Hunter’s dick picks as opposed to anything actually damning.

    https://i.redd.it/8vutbksrbnv51.jpg

    Moreover, conservatoids spent their four years in power defending the hallowed right of companies like twitter to ban whomever they want off their platforms (muh free markets). It is always good when stupidity is punished.

    2) MAGA people and Trumptards will be crushed and you will enjoy that because they are the “swine – right ”

    Cynical gaslighting. I said the aesthetics were very good and celebrated them.

    Unfortunately, they are also idiots who believe in stupid things, and their lives are going to get ruined on that account while Trump and his gaggle of grifters skunk away. One would think there would be more appropriate targets for your pent up rage, but apparently not.

    Trust the plan!

    3) Putin is the best possible choice Russians now have, it’s either him or Navalny and his Эхо Москвы militia.

    In the real world, it is the only choice.

    4) Covid restrictions are justified and those who disagree with them are “subhumans”

    What I actually said (as opposed to what you claim I said): Smart people did masks, centralized quarantines, travel restrictions. Subhuman morons got (many more) restrictions because they are subhuman morons.

    5) Anyone standing against the police is a fool.

    Swinging fists at armored policemen and ending up in jail for a few years does indeed sound pretty foolish to me.

    At least the Qanoners didn’t do it in service of a CIA gay op.

    6) Russian nationalists will be crushed and you will enjoy it.

    I will indeed enjoy seeing the minority of Russian nationalists moronic enough to serve as useful idiots for the Washington Obkom crushed in the unlikely event that that Putin actually is overthrown and replaced by some Western stooge. I also endorse Stalin’s purge of the Old Bolsheviks, so what. It is always good when stupidity and treason are punished, regardless of the vessel through which Gnon sees fit to exact his vengeance. За что боролись на то и напоролись.

    7) Everyone standing against the current radical transformation of European Civilization is an imbecile.

    • citation needed *

    8) A complete silence about the Great Reset agenda openly advertised by TPTB.

    I don’t tend to waste my time on unfalsifiable conspiracy theories.

  123. Gerard1234 says

    I also endorse Stalin’s purge of the Old Bolsheviks, so what.

    Magnificent blogging.

  124. Bashibuzuk says
  125. Bashibuzuk says

    Also:

    https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/06/now-is-the-time-for-a-great-reset/

    https://time.com/collection/great-reset/

    Doesn’t really look like a fringe conspiracy theory to me.

    Any thoughts about it?

  126. Shortsword says

    https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/Klaus-Schwab-KTU.jpg

    You should not really open this topic. You are young, playful, everything’s easy for you. This is an another thing. It’s not Snowden and not even secret services archives. Better not to get into that. Seriously, any of you would deeply regret. Close the topic and forget what was written here. I fully understand that this post incites additional interest, but I far the curious – stop. The rest will just not see it.

  127. It is nothing more than a slogan for existing trends, some of which I support (phasing out paper currency, universal income), some of which I don’t (ESG, carbon credits, “Woke Capital”). I have indeed commented on many of those issues in past blog posts, so I could only use you were referring to the Great Reset as commonly used in Internet discourse (a mishmash of schizo conspiracy theories about NWO, anti-vaxxer, the latest version of FEMA camps, etc).

  128. So basically you agree with a part of that program and have nothing else to add.

    Thank you.

  129. liberals are at core Western cargo

    Are you talking about normal middle class people, or a neoliberal elite ideologues like Chubais? Middle class generally, try to copy the values of the classes that are above them.

    Petite bourgeoisie is defined by seeking, while intrinsically never being able to fulfil, the preferences set by the haute bourgeoisie, which in turn emulates the aristocracy. And the aristocracy, in the present formation in Russia is known primarily for its aspiration recreating the lifestyle of Sean Combs and T-Pain.

    Ruling class in Russia, whether from a private sector, or managers of state owned defense corporations, can be on Instagram writing “I’m on a boat in Miami with 10 bottles of Cristal.” But the problem is the middle class people that enjoy Netflix series.

    Navalny is a crazy narcissist, who perhaps wants to present himself as a kind of self-sacrificing heroic figure, but even he still confirms in some ways to a representative of this class pattern. His children were in the Russian educational system, unlike children of officials which are schooled abroad. However, his daughter was in one of the few schools in all Russia that provides “international baccalaureate” program, i.e. Navalny was doing a cheap middle class way to try to copy the education style of children of economically higher classes of postsoviet countries, that are studying the same “international baccalaureate” curriculum at schools in London and Switzerland.

  130. I think most bloggers either don’t read and engage with comments, or if they do, they often ban commentators they disagree with. I’m sure I would get banned pretty soon if I posted anything controversial on other political blogs.

    Whereas I posted on AK’s blog/forum for many years, and he has never insulted me or deleted a comment, let alone banned me.

    So I think he is comparatively tolerant and non-authoritarian as a host. I remember there was somekind of temporary banning of Gerard a couple years ago, which most of us were sad about at the time; but it seems Karlin knows that was mistake and reversed his decision as Gerard is back now.

    Navalny is basically LARPing as a liberal to get foreign support, like Orban used to do, and then will change once in office

    He doesn’t have much change to go into any political office, anytime soon. But he is definitely a very talented YouTuber, if he can ever overcome his legal troubles and return to the desk camera.

  131. Mr. Hack – none of mine Ukrainian/Rusyn direct contacts were homo politicus, not sure if they were aware of Father Sidor and Petr Getzko Group. They did not like Janukovitch and were upset for losing Crimea to Russia as they mostly remember it as a place of pleasant holidays and beutiful girls… My position of being “sorry” for two almost identical slavic nations are hurting each other insteat of helping to fight common enemies was not understood by them, or at least remained unanswere. And yes, Right Sector was probably of higher popularity then Donbas separatists betwean them, but not to the extent of joining their ranks, as far as I knew. A three ring circus as you wrote where people mostly care of their own.

  132. There isn’t that much evidence. But it’s not impossible that she could be. It’s not like we can verify it either way.

    1. She goes to school in London, which indicates parents with above average income (although her mother is known be a rich woman independently so that’s not necessarily evidence about her father).
    2. Her boyfriend is son of Mikhail Skigin and grandson of Dmitry Skigin – the latter is also like her mother with close degrees of separation to Putin in the 1990s. Boyfriend deleted all his tiktoks and socia media after it reported (but you would do that anyway to avoid trolls so it doesn’t mean anything).

    3. She exactly the same as if like if just you added long hair to Putin. But unfortunately quite a lot of girls look like that so it’s not much evidence either.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=reLVLWIAwuQ

  133. As I recall, Ron was likewise skeptical that voter fraud is what tipped Biden over the line. His point was that it was Big Tech’s suppression of the Biden laptop story that did it.

    He wanted to have it both ways. He clearly stated ““anyone who continues to deny that the election was stolen from Trump is simply being ridiculous” but he had not offered any direct evidence that stealing has occurred.

    https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-our-disputed-election/#comment-4412580

    IMO stealing occurs in all presidential election. Sometimes it is very close like JFK-Nixon, Bush-Gore, Trump-Hillary and Biden-Trump and then allegation that election was stolen can make sense. But contesting election is un-American as it would undermine the soundness of American political system. Unfortunately the fact that large segment of population question and comest the election result is very bad for America.

  134. Skigin and grandson of Dmitry Skigin – the latter is also like her

    It’s funny that from reading the Ukrainian media reports, they were described as scary people, to impugn Putin and his and now alleged “daughter’s”‘ connections. But searching them online, appear to be a kind of gentle appearing Bukhari Jewish version of hippies, who established an environmentalist school in Switzerland, yoga festivals and the vegetarian restaurant in Saint-Peterburg. https://botanika.spb.ru/

  135. Well how many of the right own small businesses? Or work in the private sector where they are higher up the food chain? Vs. your typical reddit liberal? That might color the response on a psychological level.

  136. Thulean Friend says

    I agree that AK is a largely hands-off when it comes to moderating, which is one of his better qualities. I don’t actually mind him getting in the trenches and throwing insults, which is why I find it amusing. I have low tolerance for people bitching/moaning about it. I frequently diss AK’s takes but I don’t expect to be treated like on roses for it.

    Whereas I posted on AK’s blog/forum for many years, and he has never insulted me or deleted a comment, let alone banned me.

    That’s because you’re an extraordinarily polite person. I can’t imagine who could ever get angry at you. By contrast, most people here are much more prone to flying off the handle and throw insults. The rumble and tumble of this blog is one of its main attractions IMHO. People don’t hold back and you better be a man enough to handle that.

  137. sher singh says
  138. The majority of them. And as you know, the further a civilization degenerates, the less people you need to get to power.

  139. Probably too much, albeit I’m a “none is too many” kind of guy when it comes to such losses.

    Crimea, the occupations in South Ossetia and Abkhazia, bases in Syria, army gutted like post-Slobo Serbia, massive territorial extensions of minority republics (Russians will be bullied out just like Kosovo) and the creations of new ones, the transformation of all Siberia into a giant “free zone” (except for the badboy countries, so basically it’s the dominion of holy America). Of course the west just collapses like a decade into Somalia 2 after this would happen so it’s moot, really. All the foreigners and minorities would probably end up as chattel for some based Zhirinovsky-but-on-roids unironic schizo reactionary strongman as the world descends into a cesspit for the next millennium, 10 if we’re unlucky.

    So yeah, avoid doing that.

  140. Daniel Chieh says

    Do you have any comment on sneakers like these?

    https://twitter.com/RT_com/status/1353462585249521664

  141. AnonFromTN says

    But contesting election is un-American as it would undermine the soundness of American political system.

    The American political system is about as sound as a decomposing corpse. At least as far as “we, the people” are concerned. It is pretty sound for the oligarchs, though, as Princeton study established (here is the original:
    https://scholar.princeton.edu/sites/default/files/mgilens/files/gilens_and_page_2014_-testing_theories_of_american_politics.doc.pdfand).

    So, if undermining this system were un-American, the US would be doomed. It is not doomed yet, despite the best efforts of the oligarchs.

  142. Philip Owen says

    Demonstrations in Saratov were not organized. People turned up in at least three separate places which might have been expected to be the location. A thousand at each. Certainly more than the dozen reported by the United Russia press. Organizers, if any, were compared to Nazis/Chechens hiding behind the bodies of mothers and babies. UR is really trying to win hearts and minds here. This seems to mean they didn’t find any organizers, if any. Navalny not mentioned by name in the press, just “political prisoners”. That’s a deliberate plural. Non Navalny signs at the demos either.

    Meanwhile cheese is now 600 roubles a kilo due to the massive and predictable success of subsided import substitution in raising prices. Export tariffs and bans on field crops are also happening in a fairly desperate effort to push down input prices for the overinvested meat and dairy industries. Autarky has its disadvantages.

  143. Philip Owen says

    Khordokovsky has re-engaged Kapersky’s PR team to support Navalny. K is probably less bright politically than Beresovsky but Navalny is brighter than Kapersky. When the time comes, Khordokovsky’s mafia connections are 2nd to none. He has an intelligence service to match the FSB, means to move money and hit squads.

  144. Philip Owen says

    Russia could do better if it was less corporatist. (Putin is way beyond De Gaulle now). The genuine revival in crop production is being undermined by the need to artificially lower grain prices for the new meat and dairy processing plants. It is not however a complete disaster and Russia is far better than the late USSR in terms of delivering a liveable life to its citizens.

  145. Shortsword says

    You sound so certain. Where do you get this from?

  146. Shortsword says

    Meanwhile cheese is now 600 roubles a kilo due to the massive and predictable success of subsided import substitution in raising prices. Export tariffs and bans on field crops are also happening in a fairly desperate effort to push down input prices for the overinvested meat and dairy industries. Autarky has its disadvantages.

    Russia has gone from $16B agricultural exports in 2013 to $30B in 2020. But the agricultural production and export was already increasing on good pace before 2014. What would the difference be in 2020 without food import substitution?

  147. Philip Owen says

    I don’t the numbers to hand. This is a tablet not a PC. The ministry of agriculture tracks output not just exports so you can get some idea. Russia can now export chicken and is about there with pork. Beef, goat, Turkey, duck, various fish are all subsidized and there are brand new farms for all. 1 tonne of fish is about 1 tonne of feed. 1 tonne of chicken is 3 tonnes of feed and 1 tonne of pig is 9 tonnes of feed. Feed is 1:3 soya and 2:3 grain in each case. Roughly. So it is possible to work back but it has been a long day.

  148. Philip Owen says

    Lots of field crops for export. Some chicken and a token amount of pork. There would be more pork but the Chinese are playing hard to get and Russia is having food cost problems.

  149. Philip Owen says

    I am not sure that I am. I have some insight into the UK politics of this. As for the oligarchs, Khordokovsky is the only anti-Putin one of substance still standing not on Navalny’s target list for sanctions.Prokhorov or Potanin have no stomach for it.

  150. I don’t know, I think it’s about 50% sincere and 50% trolling for views/comments (given the ideological bent this platform the great Ron Unz has so generously provided us), anyway, it was obviously too much for a lot of the old regular Russian commenters. About a year or two/three [?] ago Glossy and Andrei Martyanov left a spray of extremely bitter (albeit highly amusing) vitriol before permanently departing here, I think the only TRUE AND HONEST Russian patriot left here is Gerard.

  151. One other thing, unlike a mainstream media outlet or someone working as a cog in one, as a relatively small private blog, Akarlin doesn’t feel hindered in pointing out that the ‘right’ (increasingly dated as these terms are) is as full of imbeciles and retards as the ‘left’, or simply making highly pessimistic predictions etc. If you want to see an effective propaganda cheerleader for rightoids that doesn’t totally insult it’s readers, you can always go to The Daily Stormer. Or Nikolai Starikov, I guess.
    Although the level of schadenfreude he takes in watching his supposed ideological fellow travellers suffer is pretty suspect, regardless of how avidly Putin studies this blog, I doubt he’ll ever have direct say in Russian policy, so it’s ultimately whatever.
    I mostly just come here for the comments, since most of the rest of this site is full of the ‘rightoid imbeciles’ Akarlin enjoys mocking so much of late. Especially Sailer’s blog… I still don’t know why that tedious guy ever got so popular.

  152. His broad shotgun approach to spinning the news and pointing out the cracks and fissures of American society is quite good.

  153. Kent Nationalist says

    AK is sadly suffering from an acute case of irony poisoning.

  154. Simpleguest says

    Lucid.

    https://ic.pics.livejournal.com/astra12bc/60035146/59523/59523_original.png

    Interpretation:
    “Want to live in Russia without Putin? Just move to Ukraine. Ukraine, it’s Russia, but without Putin”

  155. Bashibuzuk says

    I understand that, given that my own comments are mostly post-ironic level 1488 trolling. But there’s something else: in fact the current transformation of human civilization should be appealing to people who identify with transhumanist and accelerationist ideas to some extent. If you add some HBD and IQ social darwinism to the mix, then perhaps it’s easier to understand Anatoly’s take on the recent events.

  156. Daniel Chieh says

    If only.

  157. Return of Navalny to Russia significantly depleted copium supplies among Russian nationalists. Karlin went through his copium stash as if there was no tomorrow.

  158. Both of whom are “patriots” from abroad. Martyanov in particular having left for the Great Satan before the Soviet Union’s corpse was even cold.

  159. I am not sure what I owe to rightoids (or leftoids or libtards or centroids). The only ideological label I identify with and owe some degree of group loyalty to is Russian nationalism.

  160. / citations needed

  161. Russian nationalism

    The majority of Russian nationalists I am aware of have a very negative appreciation of Putin and his clique. You had yourself a negative view of Russian elite’s corruption a couple of years ago.

  162. You claimed Putin would “leave office” “within 2 years”, then changed the definition to include designating a successor (which could be someone like Dmitry Patrushev or whatever who would basically continue Putin’s policies) when challenged on it.

    You don’t have much of a leg to stand on so far as allegations of “coping” are concerned. 🙂

  163. The majority of Russian nationalists I am aware of have a very negative appreciation of Putin and his clique.

    Yes. And?

    The brighter ones (happily the majority apart from some natslibs who are really just deluded racist liberals who for some reason imagine their comrades will allow them to remain racist after the Revolution) don’t use that as an excuse to be useful stooges for a hostile foreign Power.

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Esc0Gl3XcAAUjpV.png

    You had yourself a negative view of Russian elite’s corruption a couple of years ago.

    If I am ruled by a corrupt regime that does nothing for me or my people, then sure, what’s the point of defending it.

    If it does good things for me and my people, I support it despite its flaws. It has been doing many very nice things since that time:

  164. Ah I see that is started to dawn on you that I might be right about Pynia heading for the exit.

    Anyway, you really think that Putin “being at the head” of the Russian state is all that important?

    What is important is to keep im place the extractive system that broadly favored globalized Western interests. Putin talked a lot, but did little to truly change this system. He could have done so in 2014, but he did not.

    A single stern look by the Swiss chad Burkhalter and Pynia went back to his pre-Crimean act. And now the system that he allowed to function and for which he played the talking head role is itself preparing to sideline him right as we write.

    Did you know that Friedman the younger was among the protesters in Moscow, that Mordashov has recently publicly warned that Russia would not be able to withstand more American sanctions?

    That Chubais is now officially responsible for “communication with international organizations”?

    Soon, very soon we would most probably hear something along Yeltsin’s “Я устал, я мухожук” classical lines coming from Pynia the gray.

    And yeah, this came in today:

    https://www.bbc.com/russian/news-55808924

    You remember Prikhodko and the whole Nastya Rybka affair? Who do you think the young American who joined them for some fun time on the Deripaska’s yacht was? Prikhodko could have named him after a regime change in Russia and he could have talked about the whole situation. But he’s probably not the last one being silenced in the next few months.

  165. Bashibuzuk says

    BTW, I understand now better why they have killed Tesak before his transfer to Moscow. If he would have been alive and was freed during the turbulent transition period, he might have caused a real headache to the Russian elites.

    https://youtu.be/DsKMd-ngVWU

    Мир праху!

  166. Why the hell should I or anyone care about the very important opinions of second-rate Russian oligarchs? The key decision-making body in Russia is the Security Council, not Mordashov or Friedman, at least last time I checked. In any case, Friedman has never hidden his antipathy to Russia and pro-Western sympathies, though unlike Khodorkovsky he has been bright enough to keep it low key. His son running about with the pronouns-in-bio people is one of the least surprising things in the world.

    Regarding Chubais – at this point, he is literally more based than you are:

    Петр Авен: Вы ближе с Чубайсом, чем со мной. Он менял взгляды радикально. Я говорил Чубайсу, что свои идеологические предпочтения не поменял с 1992 года, а он поменял достаточно сильно. Он рекламировал мне этот «Спутник и Погром», что удивительно слышать от человека, который в 1992 году был в нашем правительстве.

    Станислав Белковский: Ну Анатолий Борисович, мне кажется, тоже в значительной степени стал заложником своей семейной ситуации. Ему нужно было куда-то пристать. В какой-то степени «Спутник и Погром» — это следствие того эстетизма, который привила ему нынешняя супруга, для которой эстетические оценки значительно важнее этических.

    Reflect upon that, LOL.

  167. Daniel Chieh says

    I highly respect 君子报仇,十年未晚 but it does lead one down some interesting valleys and theories, methinks.

  168. AltanBakshi says

    We cannot truly change our deepest nature Tolik, you will learn that as you grow older. The only important thing is to find out who you truly are and where you truly belong.

    Heresy! Extreme heresy! But what you could expect from a man who thinks that you can be a Buddhist without taking a refuge in the Arya Triple Gem?

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e4/Tibetan_Dharmacakra.png

  169. 4Dchessmaster says

    I don’t think Tesak would have been a headache for anybody had he been released in 2017 for example. His peak years were from the documentary in which he was featured in 2004. That time was the best for any real progress from Tesak’s clique. Russia is more stable now and Tesak’s behaviour was not always easy for the Russian public to stomach. Sure, some people may find it funny that a gay guy is forced to suck a dildo on camera in an apartment in which he was lured to, but it gets old fast.

  170. I think Daniel Chieh has a good point.

    The tendency of emigres to get stuck at the point of history at which they left their country has often been noted. Glossy lives in a fantasy USSR (left in 80s iirc). Peter Akuleyev regards it as the dirty, dilapidated wasteland of the 1990s that he left. And you seem to be obsessed with 1993 to an extent that I only now comprehend (there being no such nationalists in Russia itself to serve as guideposts).

    This is not a criticism or anything of the sort, to the contrary, I can now see where you’re coming from. I obviously don’t endorse it, though, since the consequences of what you wish for are likely to be more ruinous than not for Russia and the people who live there, which happen to include myself.

  171. Bashibuzuk says

    I was just thinking about buying a plane ticket and going back home to not miss all the fun as I missed it in 1993 when I was in Paris while they killed the best among my people. But perhaps just sitting by the river that will bring their corpses floating would bring me enough satisfaction.

  172. Bashibuzuk says

    You are being right here. See my reply to Daniel. Problem is, it will most probably be ruinous anyway. These bastards are killing Russia anyway, but slowly.

    When I look back I often have the feeling that adaptation is sometimes a mistake. There are certain boundaries that we should not cross in our will to adapt or survive.

    Not as a people, not as an individual. As a genetic lineage perhaps, but this applies only to those who chose to have a family and children. Which I did.

    I actually thanked my wife a couple of days ago for making me a less extreme and more balanced individual. She had a good laugh cause she remembers whom I was when we met 22 years ago.

  173. Daniel Chieh says

    Trust me, I’m often in the same mood for blood. It might not be “reasonable” or “optimal” but the thought that innocent and good people died for nothing while their predators profit from their corpses rankles on a very deep, spiritual level.

  174. Bashibuzuk says

    I hope that I am wrong and that AK is right, but my gut feeling is that in the next few years the stability will be in short supply in Russia or anywhere else around the world. And it is in the darkest and the craziest times that people such as Tesak are the most capable of enacting change even though they mostly themselves do not benefit from this change.

  175. Well, if passionary and psychos is what we need, Russia still has no shortage of them. 😐

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxQh3gTiKL4&ab_channel=CzarTalks

  176. AltSerrice says

    Esoteric cringeposting.

  177. Philip Owen says

    Meat production was 10.8 m tonnes.in 2019. If chicken, then 20m tonnes of grain (after deducting soya from the feed). If pork, 60m tonnes of grain. I will go for 25m tonnes. Prior to import substitution RU imported 60% of meat. So let’s say local meat production has reduced grain export potential by 15m tonnes. Even so records are being broken.

  178. Bashibuzuk says

    Mil’chakov is an extreme example. But yes I believe that any civilization needs the right amount of passionarity in the Gumilyov’s sense.

    Slavs have always had many of very passionate people, which made their societies less stable and more chaotic. But having too few of them would have lead to a collapse in their populations’ vitality and probably allowed for conquest and assimilation by other neighboring ethnic and cultural groups.

    Arguably, the whole history of Russian twentieth century is the process of culling of the most passionate Russians through wars, revolutions and all sorts of social upheaval. In fact, perhaps the whole period of Romanov dynasty, at least since the Raskol, might be described as a “domestication” of the Rus spirit.

    But this is perhaps too extreme an opinion. Although when one analyzes what Romanovs did since at least Peter the Great’s times, one is entitled to draw this conclusion.

  179. And you seem to be obsessed with 1993 to an extent that I only now comprehend (there being no such nationalists in Russia itself to serve as guideposts).

    He doesn’t live in Russia currently? I mean, it’s his own business, but I’m not following what you’re implying. 1992-3 seems the crucial turning point to me, at least, as it was the last chance Russia had to turn towards a Chinese model of development, before the oligarchs had fully consolidated their stranglehold on Russia’s politics and they hadn’t yet sold the state’s resources out totally.

    Мне за державу обидно.

  180. Bashibuzuk says

    He doesn’t live in Russia currently?

    No we left in 1997.

    I agree with what you wrote, but I would think that perhaps the last chance was in the 1996 election that was actually won by Communists, but was shamelessly stolen.

    Мне за державу обидно

    И людей жалко.

  181. AltanBakshi says

    И людей жалко.

    Were they punished for their stupidity Karlin? They were naive and foolish, but such punishment was too much, too inhumane… Especially when nation undergoes thrice, less than in one century, such turmoils…

    Dont worry Bashibuzuk in the future the scars of the Russias people will be like glistering ornaments. Not a source of afflictions but signs of wisdom and experience! Everything is decaying and crumbling, all those things that we and our ancestors believed to be fundamentals of human existence, everything from faith to sexuality, from family to genders, in the far away future the experiences of the Russian nation will give them spiritual and moral protection to survive through turbulent times, protection which people like Americans and French lack. The history will not end, no matter if its the year 2021 or 2424.

  182. “…in 1993 when I was in Paris while they killed the best among my people…” – Could you expand on it? What events and which people are you alluding to?

  183. The Supreme Soviet standing against the illegal power grab by Yeltsin. From the point of view of the first Russian constitution he didn’t have the right to dissolve the freely and legally elected parliament to enforce the continuation of the destructive reforms. Both nationalists and communists, right and left stood against him and his clique, they were the majority of MPs. The media called them the Red-Browns, the military and Shoigu’s men went all in against them after a provocation and they were killed, hundreds of them. Some say up to 1500 people, but we will never know, the numbers are still classified. Many were executed in the next 24 hours by death squads after putting down arms, surrendering and being arrested. They were killed without any due process. The instigators of the stand off, the politicians, were tried and imprisoned for a time, then released in a bargain with Yeltsin and his clique. The constitution was rewritten, the Parliament renamed the Duma and the privatization was completed. The oligarchic class was created from scratch. The Western powers and Russophobic former USSR neighbors applauded.

    My mother was with the Orthodox nationalists every evening after work, cooking food and taking care of the kids that some parents brought there because they had none to leave them with. The day of the attack she was sick, that’s why she stayed at home. I was abroad and that’s why I only learned of the attack against the parliament on the TV and read about it in the news papers. The French journalists were quite supportive of Yeltsin’s actions, none spoke about the real number of victims. And they didn’t talk about the legal and constitutional side of the whole thing either.

  184. The media called them the Red-Browns, the military and Shoigu’s men went all in against them after a provocation and they were killed, hundreds of them. Some say up to 1500 people, but we will never know, the numbers are still classified. Many were executed in the next 24 hours by death squads after putting down arms, surrendering and being arrested. They were killed without any due process.

    How many people were killed that we know for sure? Is there a list of names people who allegedly were killed or went missing?

  185. https://youtu.be/gevnNDUZntk

    When the parliament was taken by the Yeltsin’s troops, the MPs were arrested and taken into buses. At the end of the video, when the bus is leaving the Parliament we can hear gun shots. That’s the beginning of the execution of the prisoners. It was in the late evening. People who live nearby tell that the execution lasted all night until around 5:00 in the morning after. The majority of the killed prisoners were executed in one of the corners of the nearby Krasnaya Presnya stadium, but some were also shot while trying to escape through the neighboring streets.

    https://pikabu.ru/story/rasstrel_na_stadione_krasnaya_presnya_5384892

    They sorted out the prisoners and shot the young men. Some of the prisoners were just teenagers they shot them as well. They took their documents before shooting them. So later on it was impossible to know who was who and anyway nobody was really interested into having a honest fact checking.

    One last thing, just like in Ukraine in 2014, the first shots again both the police and the defenders of the Parliament were supposedly fired by some “unknown snipers “. The whole violence erupted after this provocations.

  186. It’s all still classified. The estimates run from a few hundred killed to around 1500 killed.

  187. The official numbers are around 150. These are bodies who were taken to morgues and hospitals and therefore were registered and counted.

    But those who were executed on the stadium, in the basement of the Parliament and in the nearby streets have not been taken to the morgues and therefore have never been counted. They were shot down and the next day they were supposedly taken into the crematoria of the Moscow oblast where they were burned.

    https://kprf.ru/history/soviet/188463.html

    That’s the Communist’s end of the story. Of course they are not a neutral party and their witness is not impartial. That’s why I don’t think we will ever know how many people really died there.

  188. I found this:

    The snipers of Black October
    https://www.rbth.com/blogs/2013/10/12/the_snipers_of_black_october_30103

    and this

    Жертвы Черного Октября
    https://krasnoobsk.su/images/KULTURA/ISTORIIA/Okt1993/9.pdf

    where supposedly it is claimed (I still have to find it) that arrested people who were taken to the stadium were executed there.

  189. Bashibuzuk says

    They supposedly killed people on the stadium, in the nearby streets and in the entrances of some nearby buildings and in the nearby yards. Also many people were killed on the upper floors of the building when the tanks fired several dozen shells (some say more than 60). The upper levels actually burned, people burned there beyond recognition.

    But yes, the stadium was most probably the main execution site for the arrested prisoners. And many witnesses tell about them targeting the young men, young women (some were supposedly raped before being killed), the Cossacks and the RNA ultranationalists who were easy to recognize because they wore uniforms.

    Russian Jewish Betar youth organization has been recruited to assist with the execution of the prisoners. They supposedly received weapons from Shoigu and his Ministry of Emergency Affairs. This might explain why the Cossacks and the nationalists were targeted more. The young people were most probably executed to lower the number of potential future radicals.

    And it actually worked. In a country of 150 million people, the execution of a maximum of around 1500 people allowed to completely change the constitution, impose privatization and effect a radical social change. When in 1996 the election was stolen from the communist party, Zuganov was warned that if he refused to accept the outcome of the fraudulent election, then there would be blood up to the civil war. He did not have enough courage to stand his ground and gave up. He became the well paid leader of the official opposition and is still agitating for Putin today.

  190. Thanks for the link. I was not aware of the scope of the event.

    That the number of dead is being covered up I can understand. But if indeed people were systematically executed and tortured…. That there are allegations of snipers shooting from around the US embassy and the allegation of armed Jewish Betar unit…. This puts the event and the crime in entirely different category. It deserves to b described in a separate article in Ron Unz’s American Pravda series.

  191. “Russian Jewish Betar youth organization has been recruited to assist with the execution of the prisoners. “ – Interesting.

  192. reiner Tor says

    I didn’t know that about Chubais.

  193. Were they punished for their stupidity Karlin? They were naive and foolish, but such punishment was too much, too inhumane…

    https://i.pinimg.com/originals/ee/05/b2/ee05b2ba7e3277035a52253cfad82ff0.jpg

    https://www.unz.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/moscow-mcdonalds-1990.jpg

  194. When in 1996 the election was stolen from the communist party, Zuganov was warned that if he refused to accept the outcome of the fraudulent election, then there would be blood up to the civil war.

    This is a popular legend quasi-endorsed by the current kremlins (because Yeltsin is now hated), but a legend nonetheless.

    Yeltsin got 54% to Zyuganov’s 41% in the second round. It is impossible that Zyuganov could have won without fraud, which back then was still modest and confined to ethnic minority republics. The opinion polls immediately before the elections also all gave Yeltsin a convincing win.

    More detailed writeup here: https://kireev.livejournal.com/660975.html

    Demoralized 1990s Russians brought up under Soviet “world peace”/”brotherhood of peoples” idealism were just very easily manipulated by people who hated them, it’s as simple as that. They were weak.

  195. Bashibuzuk says

    I don’t believe a second that Chubais changed his opinions about Russia and the Russian people.

    BTW there were also rumors of Stan Belkovsky cosying up to the Russian nationalists. And frankly, why not? If Kolomoisky and his oligarchic buddies were able to use the Ukrainian ultranationalists to take and keep power, why not using the same tactics in Russia if and when needed?

    https://ic.pics.livejournal.com/friend/26740757/582927/582927_original.jpg

    That’s Prosvirnin of Sputnik & Pogrom with Sobtchak (the daughter of Putin’s former boss) and Stan Belkovsky.

    When the Devil plays chess he plays on both ends of the chessboard…

  196. AltanBakshi says

    I wanted to click agree button but I disagree about “Just like Biden against Trump.” American elections probably had some fraud, but on a much smaller scale than Russias in 1996, maybe few hundred thousand or million votes, but not anywhere as much as there was fraud when Yeltsin got elected a second time. But thats just my personal opinion, based on my intuition, so dont take it too seriously….

  197. AltanBakshi says

    But was it good?

    It is always good when stupidity is punished.

  198. The Betar angle might have been just an urban legend in the Russian ultranationalist fringe circles. And even if true it would probably be impossible to prove today.

  199. Execution of nationalists by Shoigu’s Jewish youth movements, sounds a little like the story of a Tarantino film.

    I can’t find anything about a youth group called “Beitar”, except on nationalist sites.
    But this is the name of the famous football team in Jerusalem with ultra-racist Arab Jewish fans, that riot in Jerusalem and add “Death to Arabs” signs.

    In 2005, Gaidamak bought the football team “Beitar”, which is probably how the name “Beitar” entered the Russian media. Although Gaidamak does add some Muslim players in the team. https://www.thedailybeast.com/are-beitar-jerusalems-racist-fans-ruining-israeli-soccer

    “Beitar” is famous for its policy to refuse to hire Arab players. Last month, there seems to be a trolling of the racist football fans, as “Beitar” was half purchased by the UAE royal family.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqUgN2wjXN4

  200. It’s almost like a reference?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_massacre_of_1961

    I was in Paris while they killed the best among my people. But perhaps just sitting by the river that will bring their corpses floating would bring me enough satisfaction.

  201. Daniel Chieh says

    Prosvirnin would have his photo taken with anyone he thought was influential imo, so I don’t think it’s meaningful. I’m not going as far as to accuse him that self-interest is his only motive, but God it seems a strong one.

  202. Bashibuzuk says

    Google в помощь.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betar

  203. He can correct me, but I think Karlin immigrated to Russia a few years ago and that definitely he lives in Moscow.

    It’s natural to have an idealizing view of the destination country’s authorities, when you moved to a country, especially if there is voluntary choice of an adult to move there.

    Authorities are very good at marketing, especially in Russia. Cynicism often requires a decade or so to acquire, after a person has soaked in the country. And of course, Moscow is a successful city, and there is objective improvements constantly there.

    • A cycle of maturity for the consumer of news and politics, follows something like:

    Illusionment. -> Disillusionment (and perhaps some cynicism and spectatorship) -> ? Wisdom (Montaigne’s “solitarium”)

    An advantage of growing up listening to the overpromising authorities as in Russia, can be something “accelerated cycle”. It needs about a decade of listening to “we going to be world leaders in nanotechnology in ten years”, without counting how many bottles of Moet that “nanotechnology” buys for “effective managers” in Saint-Tropez.

    To be immigrants in general, though, is often feeling like a second childhood, and a desire to rebelieve. Probably the main people who feel strongest the “American dream” is alive in New York today, are people who voluntarily choose to live there (i.e. the people who immigrated there from a different country). Living abroad for only a few years, I feel myself often the enchantment of the country, perhaps more than the local people.

  204. Bashibuzuk says

    Buddy, a few dozen Arabs swimming in la Seine cannot be compared to tanks firing live ammunition on the Russian Parliament in downtown Moscow.

  205. Bashibuzuk says

    LOL.

    When you can count on your people. The young Chechen (not Dagestani) MGU student who fought alone against 4 riot cops received the following message from Adam Delimkhanov, the cousin of Ramzan Kadyrov:

    https://zona.media/news/2021/01/24/redbluepill

    Salam aleikum, friends. As we all know, in Moscow and in the regions there are some shaitans who hold rallies. Like these protesters approve of the laws according to which a man can marry a man. These laws suit them, they ask these laws to be adopted in this state. Such things do not suit us. I hope we never have this.

    We all saw on social networks how a Chechen guy was waving his fists against government officials. What you did is a crime – you did it or someone else. Because people like Navalny, who say that a man can marry a man, [us] do not fit and did not fit. Your father and I talked, if you do not accept this position, if you accept the position of courage, Chechen, Muslim, you will write in direct or contact us, my friends.

    We all know, so, we talked with students together with you at Moscow State University and with your friends. They say you’re a good guy. Your father says that you do not accept the position of these people (protesters).

    If you accept their position, you should not run from anyone, you should follow them to the end. With you and with those who share this position with you, we know how to behave. But if you do not recognize their position, Ramzan-haji [Kadyrov], our padishah, said that he would help you with what concerns the law [as soon as] you show up.

    We cannot find you, we were looking for you yesterday and today. If you contact us or show up in some other way, we will help the state to resolve your issue. Good luck.

    – Adam Delimkhanov.

    So basically, a Chechen beating Russian cops is only a crime if this Chechen is supporting gay marriage. Otherwise it’s cool.

    Based.

    LOL

  206. AltanBakshi says

    That text must be made up, in no way I can believe that Kadyrovs kinsmen and courtiers call him “padishah.” Too far fetched and incongruous.

  207. Bashibuzuk says

    Yeah, I know I was also laughing about it. If the text is made up, then the Medizone people will have to offer their excuses publicly to Delimkhanov, Kadyrov and all the Chechen people. But It’s probably genuine see here:

    https://www.instagram.com/tv/CKb0EoAogAJ/

    In Vainakh language.

  208. It’s natural to have an idealizing view of the destination country’s authorities, when you moved to a country, especially if there is voluntary choice of an adult to move there.

    This is how it works with normies.

    However, you would have noticed that I was considerably more downbeat around 2017-2018 than I am today. That alone shows that said projection is inappropriate in my case.

  209. And Julia Ioffe is a (not so) secret Alt Right sympathizer, I assume.

    https://akarlin.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/meeting-ioffe-spencer.jpg

  210. Seriously though, Yeltsin was hated on an entirely different level back then. He was hated with a passion that few people still feel today about all these events. A generation has passed and as you correctly mentioned people in Russia have moved on.

    It feels embarrassing now, hence memoryholed. But Yeltsin was not hated in 1996, and Russians were some of the biggest Americanophiles in the world at that time: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/when-russians-were-americanophiles/

    Anyhow, I don’t feel like debating the point, I’d rather do more productive work. There is data (maps, opinion polls, etc.) and there are wishful assertions.

    … which at that time were under the control of Gussinsky and Berezovsky. Yeltsin’s election campaign was also managed and partly co-financed by the West.

    Correct. Media coverage being unfair and one candidate having the propagandistic backing of foreign powers does not make an election “stolen”, however. Especially not when the gap between them in the second round is 13% points.

  211. Я всегда знал, что Собчак тайная назболька

  212. You were writing something bodies floating in the river of Paris – in the context, it seemed almost like a reference to the 1961 massacre there.

    Between “Tale of Two Cities”, unfortunately Russian politics has had a tendency to emulate more of this Paris than London “style”, at least for the 20th century.

    I can’t recall reading about massacres of protesters in London of recent centuries, but as recently as 1960s in Paris they drowned 300 Algerian protesters in the River Seine.

  213. There is natural awkwardness and rivalry between immigrants and emigrants; something a bit like meeting your girlfriend’s ex-boyfriend, and vice-versa.

    But the more difficult cases are probably when the veteran immigrant becomes radically disillusioned with the country they married, and starts to dream of their first girlfriend, when she was still beautiful in his youth. I wonder how idealistic about America were the views of AnoninTN 30 years ago, when he voluntarily moved to TN. Maybe he was naively believing that he could civilize the rednecks and that his neighbours’ “listening to country music is just a temporary unpleasant phase among potential Mozart fans” .

  214. reiner Tor says
  215. Bashibuzuk says

    You were writing something bodies floating in the river of Paris

    I was writing about being abroad (in Paris, France) in October 1993, while in my home town (that is Moscow, Russia) the Parliament was being attacked by a criminal president and his cronies. The people that died in the hundreds in and around the Supreme Soviet in October 1993 were among the best people Russia had then: patriots who stood in defense of the Russian constitution against tyranny and foreign interference.

    The bodies floating down the river were a reference to an ancient Chinese proverb. I think that Daniel has understood this reference and he seems to have understood the mood in which I usually end up when I think of these events.

    If you wait by the river long enough, the bodies of your enemies will float by

    The proverb (misattributed to Sun Tzu on The Internets) means that if you cannot exact revenge, then you should patiently wait, and if you’re lucky enough, in due time you will see your enemies downfall and/or demise.

    IIRC the proverb was initially attributed to Mozi, a Chinese philosopher of the Warring States era, but I am not sure about it and last time I read about Mohism was probably some 20 years ago.

    I consider the social system that was produced in Russia as the outcome of the 1993 events, as wrong and directed against the best interests of the majority of Russian people. I love Russian people and Slavs in general. I despise and hate those who harm them. Having no way of exacting revenge against this corrupt system, all I am left with is patiently waiting to see this system’s downfall.

    Теперь понятно?

  216. Bashibuzuk says

    В этом случае она скорее была бы “нацдемка” или “нацсоцка”. Но я думаю что он скорее просто соска…

    https://www.spletnik.ru/img/2019/12/mariana/20191219-sobchak-post.jpg

    Notice the colours of the swimming suit. Zhovti-Blekitny much, perhaps she’s swimming in the Black Sea in Crimea?

  217. Bashibuzuk says

    https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/19392397.2020.1704431

    An implicit Aryan Goddess. An emanation of Cana Cludhmor perhaps?

  218. AltanBakshi says

    Anglos are not Aryan, not racially or spiritually.

  219. AltanBakshi says

    You constantly write about Bell Beaker culture, whats so interesting about them? Before your posting I had faintly heard about them, but didnt R1 Aryans just overrun them or something? Were they some kind of proto-Basques or ancestors of Sardinians, who in my knowledge are quite similar to Southern Europeans from the time before the coming of Aryan steppe invaders.

    I have understood that you believe that theres somekind of perennial struggle between those European populations who descend from bell beakers and those who dont?

    What do you know about the haplogroup I1, my fathers ancestors come from area where over half of the men have that haplogroup. I havent done a genetical test, but its most likely my Y haplogroup.

  220. Bashibuzuk says

    The Bell Beaker folks overrun half of Europe and drove nearly all other Y haplogroup lineages into extinction. In the British Isles they replaced more than 90% of all male population.

    Before the Bell Beaker expansion Western Europe was quite diverse. Y haplogroup I is one of the oldest European haplogroups strongly represented in the Megalithic Culture. Corded Ware folks were Y haplogroup R1a. Earliest European farmers were mainly Y haplogroup G, T and E.

    Bell Beaker people replaced them all nearly completely in Western and Central Europe and drove the Corded Ware Culture people to Eastern Europe beyond the Elbe. Corded Ware did survive and later thrive in Eastern Europe and Eurasia, but not in their Central European territory which stretched as far West as modern day Holland.

    It was basically a genocide of competing Y haplogroups. The Bell Beaker folks got rid of the males and kept all females for themselves.

    And while Bell Beaker folks are for some reason conflated with Yamnaya people, they are in fact distinct. The Bell Beaker came a thousand years later than original Yamnaya and are just one specific subclade of the Y haplogroup R1b. They genocided the other Yamnay derived R1b Y haplogroups as happily as they genocided any other Y haplogroup.

    I believe you read Russian, here is a great book about the interaction of R1a and R1b people by Klyosov:

    https://www.labirint.ru/books/643427/

    Don’t think it will be translated in English any time soon for various reasons, the most important and hidden among being probably this one:

    https://www.academia.edu/1988928/Turek_J_2012_Chapter_8_Origin_of_the_Bell_Beaker_phenomenon_The_Moroccan_connection_In_Fokkens_H_and_F_Nicolis_eds_2012_Background_to_Beakers_Inquiries_into_regional_cultural_backgrounds_of_the_Bell_Beaker_complex_Leiden_Sidestone_Press

    I don’t think the original Bell Beaker folks were anything else than a genocidal ethnocultural group / cult that originated in the Northwestern Africa and Southwestern Iberian peninsula. Basically, they were not European at their inception.

    Western Europeans would not want to admit that their male ancestors were mainly genocidal maniacs who migrated to Europe from the Maghrib.

  221. AltanBakshi says

    I always thought that the Middle Eastern physiognomic characteristics and skull shape among a big portion of French, Italians etc comes from those Ancient Anatolian Farmers, who brought the agriculture and primitive animal husbandry to Europe? But in your opinion those characteristics come from Maghreb?

    Thanks for the book recommendation, but I must say that book cover is somewhat off-putting to me, völkisch and corny at the same time, but as they say, dont judge book by its cover. Still quick googling tells me that Klyosov is a serious scientist, a biochemist who lives in USA. Not AnonFromTN? Heh..

    So R1b is the Bell Beaker haplogroup? I dont know much about these things, but it seems that majority of Italians and Germans dont have that haplogroup, and wasnt that same haplogroup as Yamnayas?

  222. Bashibuzuk says

    Middle Eastern physiognomic characteristics and skull shape among a big portion of French, Italians etc comes from those Ancient Anatolian Farmers

    It’s the Mediterranean or Levantine phenotype. The people of Mediterranean origin often have something in common.

    https://www.gstatic.com/tv/thumb/persons/23213/23213_v9_bb.jpg

    Would you think that he is of Irish origin?

    But once you know that the maritime Bell Beaker originated somewhere between Estremadura and Morocco, you understand the whole “Black Irish” phenotype. Same thing for the French, Italian etc. And yes, the Anatolian farmers were also quite Swarthy, we can see it on Minoan frescoes, they mainly had the J2 haplogroups and I assume they are derived from the same population as Çatal Hoyuk.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/NAMA_Akrotiri_2.jpg/1200px-NAMA_Akrotiri_2.jpg

    Also, Etruscan were Anatolian, perhaps related to the Troans.

    https://i.pinimg.com/236x/5e/18/2d/5e182d7313cf03f2d42c5c95c6c0b847–greek-history-the-romans.jpg

    And of course Southern Italy and Sicily were greatly influenced by the Arab/Berber in the medieval times.

    book cover is somewhat off-putting to me,

    I agree that it’s quite ugly.

    Klyosov is a serious scientist

    Yes, a retired Harvard Professor, a biochemist. He’s not a geneticist, but to understand haplogroups you do not need to get into population genetics. Haplogroups are basically markers/tags they don’t code for anything useful or related to phenotype.

    So R1b is the Bell Beaker haplogroup

    In Western European populations mainly yes. In Turkic people, it’s directly descended from Yamnaya through Afanasievo cultures and the subsequent related cultures (Sarmatians etc.) In Armenians it’s probably also Yamnaya, although I am not sure about it. Of course the Bell Beaker folks also are also a subclade among the Yamnaya offspring, a specific group among them.

    majority of Italians and Germans dont have that haplogroup

    Quite the opposite.

    https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSJ2Icr_6q5zB0wXSAFgg_Ok8emwqBXpTdTDg&s

    Here is Eupedia about R1b:

    https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_R1b_Y-DNA.shtml

    Here is I1:

    https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_I1_Y-DNA.shtml

  223. AltanBakshi says

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d7/Percentage_of_major_Y-DNA_haplogroups_in_Europe.png

    I based my assumption on this crude haplogroup map found on wikipedia.